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  #111  
Old 04-11-2010, 11:31 PM
Sharku Sharku is offline
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For a game like DoF perhaps the Undead faction/civilization/race could be molded into something that would better suit the resource system already in place. For example, perhaps a society of humans, elves, or orcs takes too a fanatical worship of death, and through dark magics raises armies of the dead to fight and conquer opposing factions. Of course being still very much alive this faction would require the same resources, same as any other one. Their ultimate goal could be corrupting the world, turning it into darkness and what not. Perhaps to make the whole "living controlling the undead" aspect a little more prominent is that undead units can only be summoned through necromancers of certain types. This could add a little more variation to game play as well.
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  #112  
Old 04-12-2010, 05:09 AM
DarkMaster DarkMaster is offline
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I'm all for undead if they're "necromancer summons massive, endless horde of zombies" type thing, but not if there's werewolves, vampires, ghost, that sort of thing.
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  #113  
Old 04-12-2010, 03:09 PM
blackfang blackfang is offline
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pfff werewolves were never undeads, they are just genetically impaired mutants. And vampires are people overdosed on caffeine that turned to blood sucking. Just freaks nothing remotely close to undead in awesomeness, Kill the heretics, burn the mutants, purge the uncool undeads!
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  #114  
Old 08-25-2010, 01:45 AM
TheMessengerOfDeath TheMessengerOfDeath is offline
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Default Undead races are lame.

The race labeled "Undead" has never been an interesting race in my honest opinion. If we look to other games for a reference to their "superiority" if you will, they are only effective in large swarms (much like the zerg in starcraft). In many other games they didn't receive any ability that would make them more powerful than others. There are several old games that can be used as an example here that show that even when Undead were a playable race, they were hardly ever seen cause they were vastly inferior to the other choices available. The only way the undead could be a viable race is if they were balanced in order to keep up with the other choices.

That's my two cents on the subject....
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  #115  
Old 08-26-2010, 06:41 AM
Pilgrim Pilgrim is offline
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strange two cents. There arent many RTS with online communities and an undead faction surely.
The obvious example would be warcraft III and it's expantion, with a reupuation for excellent ballance.
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  #116  
Old 08-26-2010, 08:33 AM
blackfang blackfang is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilgrim View Post
strange two cents. There arent many RTS with online communities and an undead faction surely.
The obvious example would be warcraft III and it's expantion, with a reupuation for excellent ballance.
If you want a game with excellent balance you should try pixel legions Every unit is balanced its just the way you use them. The game does not need a total balance where swordsman kill archer and archer kill spearmen and spearmen kill horsemen and horsemen kill swordsmen. I want a game where a special team of units can easily kill another. No balance needed Ok some balance needed, no one unit rampage like rp in star craft 2
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Last edited by blackfang : 08-26-2010 at 08:45 AM.
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  #117  
Old 12-06-2010, 11:13 AM
Zackreaver Zackreaver is offline
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Default Undead should be like Puppeteers

Personally, In a sense I get what the OP was going at, though personally I like having undead in a fantasy sense.

If undead should be a playable race, yeah they shouldn't be called undead, they should be called after the race of their masters. Undead can't exist without the fabled necromancer, and who says the necromancer has to be undead.

Whatever the case, whatever race plays the role of the necromancers, I think to keep the theme of the "Living dead as an army" in an rts setting should be like this. Necromancers fight in an army, having 1 minion per necromancer, when enemies are slain, the necromancers gain the essence of death from the kill to summon additional undead soldiers. However the undead should be like puppets, only existing so long as their masters command them. A role with the necromancers could be that if they die, all of the minions they summoned immediately collapse. That way a player who commands the necromancers can have their minions fight an army, in turn killing and getting reinforcements. However if their enemy manages to break past their front lines and reach the necromancers, the threat of a growing army is diminished as the necromancers are fragile on their own.

I think if "Necromancers" every get put in as either part of a faction, race, or whatever to include undead (being zombies, skeletons, ghosts, or whatever) they should play the roles of puppeteers, simply reanimating that which no longer has life, similar to how conjurers would create golems of different elements, necromancers create their minions with the dead bodies of their enemies. They use it as a fear tactic, knowing that the enemy might lose their morale having to fight an animated corpse of their fallen comrad.
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  #118  
Old 12-08-2010, 09:32 PM
Corcscrew Corcscrew is offline
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I have absolutely no problem with the undead being their own "race" or "faction" as long as they make the zombies of different races rather than merely humans who have become undead. World of Warcraft bugged me in that manner. You'd think you would see orc zombies, elven zombies, dwarf zombies, etc...
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  #119  
Old 12-08-2010, 10:46 PM
Nathikal Nathikal is offline
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In regards to this, the biggest thing that I agree on is the head sentient honcho. A vampire lord, or a great lich lord, or a mighty necromancer. All are fair game, yes? Yes.

As to the faction itself, it could be more along the lines of the Baelnorn (Baenlorn?) from D&D Forgotten Realms. If I butchered that word, or if I am thinking of the wrong thing, let me clarify: the Baelnorn that I'm thinking of are the great and powerful magicians who gave their life force to study magic eternally. Rather than being an outright lich (which has a fairly evil connotation to it) they are spellcasters who just wanted to live forever and study.

Yet someone could say, "Hey! I wanna rule the world."

This opens up the possibility of a faction which has very few natural units, but the ability to raise other units from the dead. The natural units could be the leader-types: Baelnorn, vampires, etc. The very few, rather powerful, sentient leaders. Following them could be those who have 'willingly' converted to undeath to serve and thus retain a measure of consciousness, and then the reanimated.

Reanimated could run the gamot (sp?) from summoned and bound souls to great abberations.

On the other hand...

It could be that of all the races, the undead are the most magical. They have the fewest units (perhaps two) but those units are all casters. If they want to expand their reign, they'd have to do it through very small conquests - and they can only expand their army by either raising the graveyards to their service, or by animating the dead from a battle.

Certain spells could be used to raise certain undead beings, creating a race that is based around a central core of powerful casters with numerous expendable trash. Further, spells could be used that require a living sacrifice, making the actually useful and expensive units be capable of use on the short term, instead of the long.

Some examples of beings could be...

Ascendant: The leader. The head mage of any Ascended Cell.
Ascended Council: The X Vampires who function as the highest unit.
Ascended Deliverer: The lesser, more expendable casters. Your chief lambs to the slaughter.

Spells to raise the dead could be...

Curse of Bones: Curses all enemies, giving a chance at causing a small amount of damage every few seconds. When a unit dies under the effects of this curse, they have a chance at rising as a weak Skeleton Soldier. Sacrificing increases the duration by X seconds and the chance of units rising by Y%

Curse of Soul: Curses a group of enemies, weakening morale and reducing parameters. Enemies who die under this curse have a chance to be raised as a Vengeful Soul, which can launch weak ranged attacks. Each sacrifice increases the area of effect by X%

Curse of Flesh: Curses a single enemy, causing damage initially and then causing more damage until the unit dies. Upon death, the curse spreads to 1 nearby enemy. Units who die under Curse of Flesh cannot be raised. Every 2 sacrifices increases the number of additional units affected after each death by 1.

Word of Summoning: Golem: Terminates all curses in the target area and erases each dead body, binding them into a Death Golem. The Golem begins with (Normal stats) and gains additional power based on the number of corpses. Each sacrifice increases the power of the golem by 1%.

Word of Summoning: Death: Terminates all curses in the target area and releases a shockwave from the caster, damaging all nearby allied units. The target area is then struck with a wave of black magic, which has a % chance to kill each affected unit. For every allied unit that dies from the shockwave, the % increases.

Something to that effect. They have to kill to gain power, but since it takes time to make new units, their spells are counter-effective when spammed, but are necessary to expand.

Sacrifices must be made!
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  #120  
Old 12-10-2010, 03:40 AM
Emrus Emrus is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathikal View Post
Certain spells could be used to raise certain undead beings, creating a race that is based around a central core of powerful casters with numerous expendable trash. Further, spells could be used that require a living sacrifice, making the actually useful and expensive units be capable of use on the short term, instead of the long.

Spells to raise the dead could be...

Curse of Bones: Curses all enemies, giving a chance at causing a small amount of damage every few seconds. When a unit dies under the effects of this curse, they have a chance at rising as a weak Skeleton Soldier. Sacrificing increases the duration by X seconds and the chance of units rising by Y%

Curse of Soul: Curses a group of enemies, weakening morale and reducing parameters. Enemies who die under this curse have a chance to be raised as a Vengeful Soul, which can launch weak ranged attacks. Each sacrifice increases the area of effect by X%

Curse of Flesh: Curses a single enemy, causing damage initially and then causing more damage until the unit dies. Upon death, the curse spreads to 1 nearby enemy. Units who die under Curse of Flesh cannot be raised. Every 2 sacrifices increases the number of additional units affected after each death by 1.

Word of Summoning: Golem: Terminates all curses in the target area and erases each dead body, binding them into a Death Golem. The Golem begins with (Normal stats) and gains additional power based on the number of corpses. Each sacrifice increases the power of the golem by 1%.

Word of Summoning: Death: Terminates all curses in the target area and releases a shockwave from the caster, damaging all nearby allied units. The target area is then struck with a wave of black magic, which has a % chance to kill each affected unit. For every allied unit that dies from the shockwave, the % increases.

Something to that effect. They have to kill to gain power, but since it takes time to make new units, their spells are counter-effective when spammed, but are necessary to expand.

Sacrifices must be made!

I wonder where the balancing would go if I were to play a dead-raising undead race I mean, imagina hords of zombie and skeletons attacking your city and the hero/primary unit raising them every now and then. wow lol Pro and unbeatable that wouldn't get? unless the current races get some boost against undeads.

Also since nothing is mentioned i assume that undeads if raising their troops would raise them from the dead units of the enemy army? if yes, what would be the situation in case both the attacker and the attacked person are undeads?


ummm.. this is getting interesting
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