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  #11  
Old 01-22-2011, 07:59 PM
atsumok atsumok is offline
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I like this idea a lot i think it could make the game a lot funner to play and want to get into combat more often
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  #12  
Old 01-23-2011, 07:47 AM
Sokkur Sokkur is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karl-Heinz View Post
The idea is good but from what I saw of the game, it seems he will have many units. Would be almost impossible to generate a unique character for each unit of each player, taking into account that it is an MMO.

I think that the technology nowdays would allow it. A simple text file would be used to store information about the level and equipment equipted to each invadial member of the unit type.

For example:

Unit type: swordsman
Unit name: Kyle the defender (you could give your veterans names if you wanted.) Otherwise the names would be randomly generated
Unit level: 3
Equipment Level:
Head: 1 (1 could mean wooden helmet, 2 could mean steel helmet etc. this is done to save space and time.)
Body: 5 (he is lucky to have such a high level of chest armor)
Legs: 2
Arms: 0 (he doesnít have any armguards, for now.)
Boots: 2
Etc.
Weapon: 3
Shield: 1

Another example

Unit type: swordsman
Unit name: Mike
Unit level: 1 (recruit)
Equipment level:
Head: 0
Body: 1
Legs: 0
Arms: 3
Boots: 1
Etc.
Weapon: 1
Shield: 1 (he always start with a sword and a shield. He is in fact a swordsman.)


Quote:
Originally Posted by Karl-Heinz View Post
The idea would be perfect with hero unit, but the basic soldiers would be awkward to implement, since the manual selection of loot would be very complicated and automatic can not please everyone.

It arenít weapons or armors with different stats it is just better stats. For example: A swordman would not equip a spear instead he would equip a same type of sword but with better stats.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Karl-Heinz View Post
Now, apply the concept of experience to the battalions is the wisest thing to do. This has always been present in games, since the Old but Gold Master of Magic. And that the ranks gaining experience in accordance with their deeds in battle, without the option of the player to choose, because that would just be ridiculous.

I dont see why it would be so ridiculous to give orders to your troops to convert every looted equipment to recourses or allow them to equip the loot.

For the experience your troops would still get experience even if you would order them to convert every loot to recourses.


Some further ideas:
The strongest member(who has the best equipment, higest level etc. combined together) of each unit type would automatically become a leader of the unit type and if killed in a battle a short cutscene would show he being killed, like in total war games. There would however be an option that would disable the cutscenes.
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  #13  
Old 01-23-2011, 07:48 AM
Sokkur Sokkur is offline
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What would you want?

1. Keep with the current idea that a recruit cold start with an equipment of any level (the changes will decrease the higher the equipment level is) and when they are killed one of those equipment pieces will be available for other solider of the same unit type, who doesn’t have the given equipment piece, to loot and equip it

2. Or Let it be so a unit member would only be able to have equipments that are up to his level (for example a level 3 unit would be able to equip level 1, 2 and 3 equipments but not level 4,5,6 etc equipments). When killed the loot he would drop would depend on level and equipment equipped. (For example a level 4 unit with level 3 helm (if the head equipment was chosen to appear as a loot) would have a 40% change to drop a level 3 helm, 20% change to drop level 4 helm, 20 %change to drop level 2 helm, 10% change to drop a level 1 helm and 10 % change to not drop anything at all.)

Similarly a level 4 unit member that has only equipped a level 1 helm would have 40% to drop a level 1 helm 30% to drop nothing at all, 20% to drop a level 2 helm 5% to drop a level 3 helm and 1% to drop a level 4 helm.

Unit will not drop equipment beyond their level.

For both of those ideas you could still upgrade your units equipments for a price when not in battle.
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  #14  
Old 01-23-2011, 01:36 PM
Karl-Heinz Karl-Heinz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sokkur View Post
I dont see why it would be so ridiculous to give orders to your troops to convert every looted equipment to recourses or allow them to equip the loot.

For the experience your troops would still get experience even if you would order them to convert every loot to recourses.
No man, you don't understand what I meant. I meant that the player will not be able to choose which troops will the experience. As another guy said before, if that is possible will be people getting all the experience gained in battle and focusing on only one battalion, creating an elite group of early in the game.
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  #15  
Old 01-23-2011, 02:41 PM
Sokkur Sokkur is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karl-Heinz View Post
No man, you don't understand what I meant. I meant that the player will not be able to choose which troops will the experience. As another guy said before, if that is possible will be people getting all the experience gained in battle and focusing on only one battalion, creating an elite group of early in the game.
You are true on that. The experience and loot would be shared equally between the battalions.
The strongest battalion would be one that had survived the most battles. However there would be some equipment varity witihn the battalion itself.
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  #16  
Old 01-24-2011, 06:47 AM
ElegantPete ElegantPete is offline
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Question The Gamble - Random is your friend.

The idea of gaining experience from looting the dead is probably much simpler to implement for the devs. However, allowing for units, or individuals to acquire random items really adds the addictive, 'just one more go' gambling feel that the devs need to keep people playing/hooked.

If the loot was appropriate for the enemy, and somewhat random this is a winning combo. You could include potentially rare items but this would have to be controlled world wide to reduce inflation.

If you could allocate items to a unit, and randomly apply the visual effect to individuals within that unit that would be best imo. I feel that it's important to avoid having a block of soldiers that are walking in time with uniform weapon swings and identical armor, weapons, etc. Sure this would be appropriate for some units, (elite human cavalry?) but high inappropriate for orcs of any sort.

In short, people love to roll the dice... inlude as many forms of this in the game as you can and you'll have a winner.

Random is your friend.
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  #17  
Old 01-25-2011, 11:10 AM
Lukre Lukre is offline
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Thanks For the imformation
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  #18  
Old 01-26-2011, 09:01 AM
Negthareas Negthareas is offline
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Just to keep in mind... units are together in battalions [or companies... whatever you want to call them.] Eventually, micromanaging each soldier would become nerve-racking and time-wasting as you army expands. You will just want to get into battle, or appreciate the many other aspects of DoF.

That is why I suggested the experience option for battalions as a whole. To be realistic, I think that if anything is done in this area, it will have to be on a battalion-wide scale. I just don't think there would be enough players out there that appreciate such a high level of micromanaging that the Devs would consider implementing individual unit changes.

Also, unless you almost never play, or are a very bad player, or just like having absurdly small armies, keeping up with micro unit changes would be impossible.

Also, just a note: battalions do earn experience porportional to the amount of foes they kill in battle, etc.. in a lull in combat or even after the battle, the player can assiagn which categories these experience points fit into for the battalion, meaning that the player can specialize certain battalions for certain tasks. Also, there is a training grounds in the game, where players can pay in gold to have their units trained [to get more experience].

In DoF, experienced veteran units pack a whallop against their normal opponents, though they are still vulnerable to their normal counters. But Experience points take a while to get, hence the training option that already exists. However, as I said before, I think that this looting system would be an interesting way to supplement training and combat as a means to gain experience.
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  #19  
Old 01-26-2011, 10:19 AM
Sokkur Sokkur is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Negthareas View Post
Just to keep in mind... units are together in battalions [or companies... whatever you want to call them.] Eventually, micromanaging each soldier would become nerve-racking and time-wasting as you army expands. You will just want to get into battle, or appreciate the many other aspects of DoF.

That is why I suggested the experience option for battalions as a whole. To be realistic, I think that if anything is done in this area, it will have to be on a battalion-wide scale. I just don't think there would be enough players out there that appreciate such a high level of micromanaging that the Devs would consider implementing individual unit changes.

Also, unless you almost never play, or are a very bad player, or just like having absurdly small armies, keeping up with micro unit changes would be impossible.
In my idea you don't micromange the equipment of indvidual members of the battalions. They would mange their equipment themselvs automatily. You would just need to press the "loot and equip" botton and it is done. The remaining equipment (that no one needs on the battlefield) would be consumed to resources.


If you still don't understand me, go play Overlord demo and you will understand.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Negthareas View Post
Also, just a note: battalions do earn experience porportional to the amount of foes they kill in battle, etc.. in a lull in combat or even after the battle, the player can assiagn which categories these experience points fit into for the battalion, meaning that the player can specialize certain battalions for certain tasks.[to get more experience].

How could the opposite player see that for example: this swordmen battalion is specialized in charging? If they are not going to see it then it must not make a big impact on the battalion performance in the specialized category.


Some further ideas:
Yoy cold (if you wanted) see the battalions going around and picking up equipment after the battle.

Last edited by Sokkur : 01-26-2011 at 10:40 AM.
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  #20  
Old 01-27-2011, 07:56 AM
Negthareas Negthareas is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sokkur View Post
How could the opposite player see that for example: this swordmen battalion is specialized in charging? If they are not going to see it then it must not make a big impact on the battalion performance in the specialized category.
Some further ideas:
Yoy cold (if you wanted) see the battalions going around and picking up equipment after the battle.
Ok, I understand now. However, in reality, a general might not know that specific units were good in specific areas [due to experience], unless he observed them in action. [He could always click them in battle and see their stats]. So, I think that that is actually a point for reality.

The picking up equipment idea sounds fine, it could add experience and then also cosmetic variances to the group. Overall - I don't think it practical to keep track of equipment besides its cosmetic effects - the only practical way I can think of it being implemented is through experience.
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