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SunSic
07-13-2013, 09:32 AM
i have followed this game since it was in development. i was very excited when it finally went to beta, even tho we could only try out single player. when it finally released i got it right away, anxious to play an actual mmorts. i spent a week raising an army, and fought 50 million bandit camps, leveling that army up (even tho every upgrade i did, to any unit, did not stick, and i would always hafta re-apply the upgrades everytime i clicked on a unit). im not too much into pvp, but, i was pretty confident that id be able to hold my own, with my army of 200 well-trained soldiers!

then... the very first attack on my castle! the anticipation and excitement of being able to pit my army against another's! until i saw that the opponent had come at me with a whopping THREE (3) units. thats it. his entire army consisted of THREE (3) units. it might have been laughable, had these THREE (3) units not tore up my ENTIRE army. yes, the one i spent a week training up. i dont care if youre uber ninja orc on crack... 3 dudes should NOT be able to destroy an entire army of 200 or so soldiers. this person won because they paid a few dollars more than i did, and so, got a few units that are apparently immune to regular damage. it was absolutely rediculous. i was so terribly disappointed in this game, that held so much promise.

uninstalled :(

R-A-B
07-13-2013, 10:03 AM
i have followed this game since it was in development. i was very excited when it finally went to beta, even tho we could only try out single player. when it finally released i got it right away, anxious to play an actual mmorts. i spent a week raising an army, and fought 50 million bandit camps, leveling that army up (even tho every upgrade i did, to any unit, did not stick, and i would always hafta re-apply the upgrades everytime i clicked on a unit). im not too much into pvp, but, i was pretty confident that id be able to hold my own, with my army of 200 well-trained soldiers!

then... the very first attack on my castle! the anticipation and excitement of being able to pit my army against another's! until i saw that the opponent had come at me with a whopping THREE (3) units. thats it. his entire army consisted of THREE (3) units. it might have been laughable, had these THREE (3) units not tore up my ENTIRE army. yes, the one i spent a week training up. i dont care if youre uber ninja orc on crack... 3 dudes should NOT be able to destroy an entire army of 200 or so soldiers. this person won because they paid a few dollars more than i did, and so, got a few units that are apparently immune to regular damage. it was absolutely rediculous. i was so terribly disappointed in this game, that held so much promise.

uninstalled :(

Multiplayer has a feel that goes against common expectations and as such can initially be deeply frustrating untill the hidden tricks and traits can be learned.
I would also ask if these 3 units were indeed units or single 'heroes', if so its possible that a combination of skill spending meant that the amount of men you can put around them in melee combat did not do enough damage to outweigh there regen and resistances. Something like this is best countered by specing mass damage and hoping you can wear them down.

I do hope you read this because I can speak from experience that my first multip[layer was a keyboard throwing nightmare that ended in an angry 'report a bug' mail to the devs. But upon deep reflection I was playing the game the way I thought it should be played, not how it actually should be played and changing my playstyle helped dramatically improve my happiness with the game.

I will say that with smaller, more elite armies the problem is you can only get so many people hitting them in the face and as such (as I've said before) high resistances and regen can make them appear immortal. Counters to this are plenty of archers that can all attack regardless of man-to-man contact and as such have a massively increased dps advantage. give them fire arrows that provide 125 of completely unmitigated damage for every man in the unit and those heroes will drop like sacks of arrow punctured and burnt potatoes.

I hope you get a chance to read this, have a rethink and give the whole thing another go.

Hi11Zone
07-13-2013, 04:40 PM
His three units or 3 hero's, had nothing to do with pay to win, you can easily get the same units just by playing the game. What level was your army and your units how were they specced, you need to take that all into account.

theinternetman
07-13-2013, 05:35 PM
These players quitting will hopefully be a wakeup call for unit resistances to be nerfed across the board. I would even go so far as to suggest the complete removal of the ability to upgrade unit resistances because clearly the developers are not aware of the insane mitigation never seen in any other RTS to date that is present in DoF.

Hi11Zone
07-14-2013, 10:33 AM
Once again I will re assure you, it is not pay to win, yes you can build faster, yes you can buy resources or units, but you still have to spend hours leveling them. Also you probably had no idea but their is daily rewards for free for all players for any item in the market place including units.

I could buy 100000s crowns, and I would be no better then a player with 200. You can't fight someones castle if they have a higher rank then you. This is an mmo, its supposed to be slow, your supposed to get satisfaction of building up your town. An average town with out crown spending can take 25 hrs. Your not supposed to be done in 1 hr like starcraft or age of empires. Yes their is a very steep learning curve, I will give you that, but we have so many great team members to asist you and great threads on the forum to help you out.

Crowns are so easy to earn. so many of our players can earn up to 500 a day, it's not hard at all, and i've shown the community how to do it.

And once we finish our pathfinding patch, almost done bye the way, it will be a brand new game. Keep in mind their is only 5 of us working on a 20 person project.

Cocozaurus
07-16-2013, 11:08 AM
Resistances should be capped at 60% maximum, it's just ridiculous how far it could get. And with the HP regen it goes even worse.

It's not a Pay to Win, it's just that the combat system is not good enough to provide full enjoyment.

EnglishPlayer
07-16-2013, 02:23 PM
Once again I will re assure you, it is not pay to win, yes you can build faster, yes you can buy resources or units, but you still have to spend hours leveling them. Also you probably had no idea but their is daily rewards for free for all players for any item in the market place including units.

I could buy 100000s crowns, and I would be no better then a player with 200. You can't fight someones castle if they have a higher rank then you. This is an mmo, its supposed to be slow, your supposed to get satisfaction of building up your town. An average town with out crown spending can take 25 hrs. Your not supposed to be done in 1 hr like starcraft or age of empires. Yes their is a very steep learning curve, I will give you that, but we have so many great team members to asist you and great threads on the forum to help you out.

Crowns are so easy to earn. so many of our players can earn up to 500 a day, it's not hard at all, and i've shown the community how to do it.

And once we finish our pathfinding patch, almost done bye the way, it will be a brand new game. Keep in mind their is only 5 of us working on a 20 person project.
Honestly, i wish the game-play development was even slower. i find myself losing interest in the game due to it not fulfilling my sim-city needs (not enough buildings, everything gets finished SO DAM FAST) Resources come so easily and quickly, they are hardly even a factor. If you ever played games like Ogame or ikariam, those are quite similar to DoF, only they are browser games and have a lot less functional control. i was so excited for DoF being a live moving version of those, but sadly DoF maxes out too fast. playing those games (ikariam and ogame) it took -days- to complete high level buildings, it took actual resource grinding to start their upgrades. research wasn't instant, they took days, sometimes weeks to complete.

but i must inquire, does the company actually make money pass the initial sale of the game to the players? because it seems like crowns are so easy to come by that their isnt a need to spend real cash into the game.

Konstantin Fomenko
07-17-2013, 11:17 AM
@EnglishPlayer

It`s true - only 0.3% of our players buy crowns, and we look at it more of a way for players to donate to our company, rather than us greedily milking players, and as you have guess - we are not making much on this at all. Besies - we treat these funds - as players "investing" into new content, and. So for example whatever funds we got from Crown sales in April/May went into paying for the 4 (with 2 more to come) new units we added in July. And with current income we received for Crown sales in June/July we plan to add several new units later this summer.


@Cocozaurus, theinternetman

To some extent I agree with 60% cap and self-healing decrease. As you could see we are constantly working on the balance - with every patch bringing new changes, so with time we`ll find the right values be it 60% or 70% or 80% for resistance.

@R-A-B
Sorry to hear about your bad experience. I`ll raise this with our balancing scripter Vicious and see if maybe it`s time to lower resistance/self-heal rates.

Keep in mind though - if you would have had stone walls - these heroes would be unable to breach your town walls. Also the max limit of units you could have had in your town was 90. And as another player suggested - it`s really easy to deal with these heroes by focusing all your units on one hero.

R-A-B
07-17-2013, 12:45 PM
@EnglishPlayer

@R-A-B


You mean @Sunsic!

theinternetman
07-17-2013, 02:59 PM
I'm usually the first to scream pay to win but anyone who thinks DoF is pay-to-win is blissfully (or not so blissfully) unaware of how easy it is to farm crowns by just doing NPC sieges or PvPing. Any item mall system that lets you directly earn the cash shop currency by playing the game is by definition not pay-to-win.

Half the reason why I can overlook some of the issue with DoF is that the cash shop system is extremely fair toward non-paying players.

@EnglishPlayer
Cool Post

Awesome, glad to see you're looking into it. To be honest I am one of the players abusing the insane mitigation of units but it's not in the best interest of this game being successful if people quit because of imbalanced units.

vicious666
07-17-2013, 03:36 PM
Regards hp regen for normal unit is in program a hard cap of 15hp/sec , and a reduction of area effect dmg that stack up like for example firewall from dragons, regards res : i am gonna start lowering units case by case ,if you notice recently dmg got augmented on majority of units. as well ability, and dragons dmg.

Balancement is a slow and continuous work, i cant just Bam lower all units res in game by 20%/30%, many factor must be considered, such as single soldier dmg/Hp, how many soldier there is for batallion, unit precision, unit attack rate, if the unit have certain bonus towards cavalry or monsters, the kind of dmg the units does., the movement speed, the upgrades, the racial traits.

IS much more complicated that it seams, so we proceede by small amounts 5-10% at time

axal011
07-25-2013, 01:05 AM
I have bought crowns over the years, my intentions were not to get this and that as quick as possible but because I love the game and it is my intention to Support this company as much as possible, oh and those who say they followed the game since developement don't seem to show legit record of it.. look at my join date for example.. Im known as Fuddan in game...

auroxyd
07-26-2013, 09:16 PM
i've heard that so many time, about so many game this word : balance or nerf and so on. for DoF since i play it, yes i'm kinda new for this game, i haven't found it so unbalanced, but completly balanced for any kind of gamer. i explain :
you guys know the old scientific test for the kids : eat the marshmallow now, or wait 30 minute and you will have 5. this game is all about that. if we want to avoid a pvp at start, just lock your town at 19 peeps, and take absolutely all your time to build your armys decently, stack the food, wood, rock, raise your town, and once you feel ready to go, open your town !(hold wall palisade until you are ready):)
Actualy i won't a game fotm fast-paced, it's a strategic game, mitigation high = more time to build a strat, even if 90% seem's realy high, there is always a hole in the armor (rock, paper...).

i.e i'm not pay to win about anything (despite the fact i will do if it was possible, i mean to support this game), starting a new town since 3 days, still under attack protection, and i plan at least 1 week more until i open the gate. army with 1 heros level 60 (max attack 800 = , no need to say the units infront of him must be fully geared with all upgrade) 2 high knights level 39, 2 dwarf champion level 45, 2 Orcs warlords level 30, and 3 shaman...level 2 :p
all of that to say : we have time to build the game, town or whatever that we want. how many game give you the possibility to play exactly as you want it? just be curious, explore some map, read some post, and you will find anything, for casual or hardcore gamer.

Apologies for my basic english, and good game !

vicious666
08-15-2013, 07:50 PM
i have followed this game since it was in development. i was very excited when it finally went to beta, even tho we could only try out single player. when it finally released i got it right away, anxious to play an actual mmorts. i spent a week raising an army, and fought 50 million bandit camps, leveling that army up (even tho every upgrade i did, to any unit, did not stick, and i would always hafta re-apply the upgrades everytime i clicked on a unit). im not too much into pvp, but, i was pretty confident that id be able to hold my own, with my army of 200 well-trained soldiers!

then... the very first attack on my castle! the anticipation and excitement of being able to pit my army against another's! until i saw that the opponent had come at me with a whopping THREE (3) units. thats it. his entire army consisted of THREE (3) units. it might have been laughable, had these THREE (3) units not tore up my ENTIRE army. yes, the one i spent a week training up. i dont care if youre uber ninja orc on crack... 3 dudes should NOT be able to destroy an entire army of 200 or so soldiers. this person won because they paid a few dollars more than i did, and so, got a few units that are apparently immune to regular damage. it was absolutely rediculous. i was so terribly disappointed in this game, that held so much promise.

uninstalled :(

Your argument are invalid. first becouse is soo generic that not deserve even a serious reply, you not specified what units he got what levels, what kind of skilling , you even accused that he payd for such units, and tbh not exist unit in game that you cant get thrue normal play , so payd or not, anyway thegame match your army based on strenght so the pay to win argument is total invalid. he can buy thrue real money 50 heroes if his army have 5000 strenght he will not be matched against a 2000 str army.

The way you talk show to me that you have very low knowledge of the game , your units where probably completely wrong low level and bad skilled, you should reconsider your position and focus more on learn how the game works.

There is units that counter totally other units, so even if you have 10x of them, they are very ineffective even vs only 5 units of their direct counter.

Cheggers2509
08-15-2013, 08:19 PM
Pay 2 win? really sorry first post on these forums but no where near is it pay 2 win!

Been playing 10/11 days now, My human pretty much has every hero at least level 30 but only 2 dragons the red and green. Did buy some crowns the first day what is lol now I know a thing or two about the game and how to get crown's. A human can easily get 50-80 crowns a hour with 3 army's in the first 3-5 hours of game play if done right.
Now my elf has 3 armies of almost all level 20 normal units that used gold to level up has all 3 crown shop dragons at around level 25. it has 50 Dwarf miners that can only be brought from the crown shop 7/10 army slots unlocked. And here is the funny part not one code or cash has been spent on the elf character.

This game is so far from pay to win I really don't see why anyone after the first day or so would spend real money on this game other than to support Reverie worlds what I will do some time.
Now if you was going to go on about balance of unit/race's in game I might agree with you (ok will agree) but that is a whole different story that has nothing to do with this post or this childish mentality that most online gamers have nowadays that if they don't understand a game or how it works and has a cash shop that even if only sold cloths will call it pay 2 win some how.

If anything the cash shop is bad, should feel bad and hell does feel just so bad that they should give free stuff everyday to every character in game...... Oh hold on they do that anyway.

Phandaal
09-23-2013, 10:03 AM
OP doesn't understand the mitigation/regen mechanics.

As was already mentioned, some focused fire arrows would have ended this attack in seconds.

This post is the equivalent of a kid playing chess for the first time. Playing black. Getting checkmated in 5 moves with the "Children's Checkmate" strategy. Then posting how the white pieces need to be nerfed.

No clue.