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View Full Version : Couple of things before I purchase


Pepi18
10-01-2011, 06:44 AM
Hi,

I was browsing mmorpg.com today and discovered this game has just been released in the news section. I have been looking for an RTS game set in a persistent world with and against other players for a while now and was given a pleasant surprise today when I discovered Dawn Of Fantasy. What can I say, it is exactly as I had pictured the game I am looking for should be. I am delighted!

I have a three queries about it though before I seal the deal and purchase the game.

1. Server structure. Background: [There are three types of server structures in MMOs today. The most well known of these structures is made up of many shards or servers each housing a portion of the player base, where the players are constricted to that server only leaving the games community divided between the servers. This structure is popularized by WoW and most games follow it. Second there is a similar structure involving multiple servers, but where the player gets to choose a server whenever deciding to play and can switch servers at will such as with Guild Wars, Guild Wars 2 and Runescape. Finally there is the epic and ambitious albeit expensive structure of housing the entire player base on one server cluster as is most well known to be done by Eve Online.]

Personally I can't enjoy playing in a sharded community and any game with a sharded server structure (no matter how good) I cannot play. Does DoF have more than one server? If so, does it allow you to switch servers if you desire?

2. Player base and popularity. I have a thing that when I choose to play an MMORPG (or MMORTS) that it has to have a decent and growing player base and popularity. As I said above I was quite stunned and awed by my discovery of DoF and what it has to offer (although I can't yet know how it plays), however was underwhelmed by the fact that theres not much to find about it out there. It seems as though DoF hasn't been marketed very well and that it is not on many peoples radar. This worries me. Is the player base healthy and growing and should I be worried by the apparent lack of hype?

3. Community. My final concern is about the age level and maturity of the community in DoF in general. I have known MMOs in the past in which my experience was ruined by a bad community, often resulting from the player base consisting primarily of a young age group. How is the DoF community?

Well I know I have asked allot! I would be very grateful if someone could answer my concerns before I think about purchasing Dawn Of fantasy. It really looks wonderful and I hope I'll see you in game soon :).

Cheers

BrandungsFels
10-01-2011, 07:44 AM
greetings

point1: as far as i know its all located on one server

point2: marketing has not been started yet i think

point3: well, so far i can say honestly that iam surprised about the nice atmosphere on server - even though i can not imagine more than half of the players being 20+, i have not encountered any rude discussion :)


my advise: just buy it (30euro for a game is pretty fair) - its definately worth it, especially when thinking of the plans the devs got with this game (its far from finished)


regards
-Fels

Jarno Montonen
10-01-2011, 09:05 AM
I second BrandungsFels' answers. Especially the last advice! ;D

So yeah, you will be able to interact with every single player from around the world. No regional division of any kind. The player base is healthy and growing and I can say that we are especially broud of the community all together!

Henry Martin
10-01-2011, 10:17 AM
1) Right now everyone is on the same server.

2)Yes, DoF right now isnt on everyones radar, but there is word of mouth and people stumbling into the game (you have XD). Our publisher has decided to delay our marketing, which I believe is due to allowing us to smooth out the gameplay some more and to add more features. So that when they do and more people join it, they will enjoy the game more.

3)Yes even during the beta the community was amazing. There was still those that had to rage about every little thing but every game has those.

Another point to add is that we are constantly fixing the game and plan to do so for how ever long we need to. For the next few months we are going to be patching the game pretty heavily for both bugs and features.

Pepi18
10-01-2011, 04:40 PM
1) Right now everyone is on the same server.

2)Yes, DoF right now isnt on everyones radar, but there is word of mouth and people stumbling into the game (you have XD). Our publisher has decided to delay our marketing, which I believe is due to allowing us to smooth out the gameplay some more and to add more features. So that when they do and more people join it, they will enjoy the game more.

3)Yes even during the beta the community was amazing. There was still those that had to rage about every little thing but every game has those.

Another point to add is that we are constantly fixing the game and plan to do so for how ever long we need to. For the next few months we are going to be patching the game pretty heavily for both bugs and features.


Well that all sounds great to me! It's good to hear a reasonable explanation as to why what appears to be such a great game hasn't been marketed yet and that the community is good too. I would still like to get some more info on how the servers will be structured once (and if) the player base overpasses the first server.

Thanks for you're responses - they were all helpful :).

I'll see you in game once I have finished purchasing and downloading xD.

chanman20
10-01-2011, 05:43 PM
i have to say i love the community and the devs. i know a few games like PWI and WoW have a lot of jerks plus they don't fix the bugs instead they add new stuff which also has bugs

Sephriem
10-01-2011, 06:33 PM
Hi,



2. Player base and popularity. I have a thing that when I choose to play an MMORPG (or MMORTS) that it has to have a decent and growing player base and popularity. As I said above I was quite stunned and awed by my discovery of DoF and what it has to offer (although I can't yet know how it plays), however was underwhelmed by the fact that theres not much to find about it out there. It seems as though DoF hasn't been marketed very well and that it is not on many peoples radar. This worries me. Is the player base healthy and growing and should I be worried by the apparent lack of hype?



I read that the devs are waiting a month to start advertising (from a post on the DoF section of the mmorpg.com forums). He/she said they are planning to make major improvements and whatnot this month and will start marketing soon after.

Joseph Visscher
10-01-2011, 10:30 PM
plus they don't fix the bugs instead they add new stuff which also has bugs

We do some of that too sometimes,,, but at least we are honest. ;)

andreicde
10-01-2011, 10:42 PM
We do some of that too sometimes,,, but at least we are honest. ;)

o.O really?OMG GIMME REFUND@@@ lol jk

But at least you guys are ACTUALLY patching the game. Saw tons of games that had bugs from the beginning,important bugs that were never fixed.

Pepi18
10-01-2011, 11:39 PM
Well I purchased the game and gave it a try... While it obviously needs allot of cleaning up any many regards that was ok... Untill I hit the cash shop.

One look at that cash shop has buy to win written all over it. Now I know that you can't buy crowns yet and even when you can you will still be able to work for them, but that doesn't change the fact that it is a buy to win game (like Runes of Magic etc). Pay to win is a dealer breaker for me. Just look at the riots that happened when Eve Online made a cash shop. Look at all the concerns about the future Guild Wars 2 cash shop (which they assured is going to be purely cosmetic). I won't play a game where players will pay to win. I'll continue waiting for Guild Wars 2.

Sorry no dice... I wish I had been aware of this before I spent my money - there was no immediate mention of it with the lack of information around. But don't let me stop others from enjoying the game. It looks WONDERFUL and is full of potential and just because this business model doesn't work for me doesn't mean it won't work for you. I'm sure many people will be OK with a gameplay boosting cash shop.

I wish everyone all the best with Dawn of Fantasy and thank you for being so helpful and friendly, cheers!

xeovy
10-02-2011, 01:38 AM
here do not have to pay anything.
The crowns are obtained with missions, pvp and attacking cities.
Even the new content so you can get without paying.
there are 2 options, paying or not paying.

Sephriem
10-02-2011, 02:48 AM
here do not have to pay anything.
The crowns are obtained with missions, pvp and attacking cities.
Even the new content so you can get without paying.
there are 2 options, paying or not paying.

This. Also there aren't many MMORTS games out right now. Most of them are crappy browswer games that really do ask you to hand your paycheck over to them. The only other online MMORTS game that comes close to this would be AoE Online, but even that asks you to pay a **** ton to unlock even a different race. It's like 20$ just to unlock a new race there.

Pepi18
10-02-2011, 04:10 AM
This. Also there aren't many MMORTS games out right now. Most of them are crappy browswer games that really do ask you to hand your paycheck over to them. The only other online MMORTS game that comes close to this would be AoE Online, but even that asks you to pay a **** ton to unlock even a different race. It's like 20$ just to unlock a new race there.

Aye that is perfectly true - MMORTSs are hard to come by. I tried AoE Online when it launched for 2 weeks as well. It was far more polished and smooth however it had its own set of problems and neglect which left me unmotivated to play once I reach end game. Also worth noting is AoEO does not have a cash shop with game boosting items for sale - it does have bonus content packs for sale. Even though AoEO can be extremely overpriced (although you don't have to choose to buy all the content) it wasn't a problem for me because there was no concern of paying to win; even if you purchased content packs you would still have to work just as hard to win.

Its like I said in the beginning; this game, if and when it works smoothly, is a perfect fit for my MMORTS dream and there is no other game out there to come close to beating it. However, even though you can choose to pay for crowns or work towards them, they have a high risk of unbalancing the game in ways I do not enjoy; I have seen it so many times before. HOWEVER...

It is also a possibility that Dawn of Fantasy will still be good EVEN with a game boosting cash shop and that it will not ruin the fun (for me). Seeing as there is no alternative MMORTS for me I might stick around for a bit and see where it goes. Time will tell.

Well thanks for being patient and listening to my concerns guys... I'll stick with DoF and keep a positive attitude :).

Sephriem
10-02-2011, 04:22 AM
Aye that is perfectly true - MMORTSs are hard to come by. I tried AoE Online when it launched for 2 weeks as well. It was far more polished and smooth however it had its own set of problems and neglect which left me unmotivated to play once I reach end game. Also worth noting is AoEO does not have a cash shop with game boosting items for sale - it does have bonus content packs for sale. Even though AoEO can be extremely overpriced (although you don't have to choose to buy all the content) it wasn't a problem for me because there was no concern of paying to win; even if you purchased content packs you would still have to work just as hard to win.

Its like I said in the beginning; this game, if and when it works smoothly, is a perfect fit for my MMORTS dream and there is no other game out there to come close to beating it. However, even though you can choose to pay for crowns or work towards them, they have a high risk of unbalancing the game in ways I do not enjoy; I have seen it so many times before. HOWEVER...

It is also a possibility that Dawn of Fantasy will still be good EVEN with a game boosting cash shop and that it will not ruin the fun (for me). Seeing as there is no alternative MMORTS for me I might stick around for a bit and see where it goes. Time will tell.

Well thanks for being patient and listening to my concerns guys... I'll stick with DoF and keep a positive attitude :).

I agree with this, it does have potential to turn into a cash grab game, like most MMORTS games choose to go this route by selling some pretty imba items in cash shops. One example that comes to mind is the +300% build speed you can buy in Lord of Ultima. If you pay for this item, in a week you'll have the same castle/army as someone who spent a month playing this game and you'll probably own them up.

Another thing I see with games like Lord of Ultima that this game has is dev interaction. There is nowhere that you can go to express your concerns to the dev team and have them listen. In this game, you make a thread on these forums and 80% of the time a dev will see it, at least it seems this way. Just by this amount of community interaction I have hope that they won't make some crazy cash shop items that will imba the game, and that they will have it reasonably priced.

About the AoEO comments, They do only sell content and no p2w items. Although I don't think it's fair to compare a game like AoEO made/published/maintained by industry giant Microsoft to this game made by an indie developer! I only played AoEO for a week or so, but I did some research on popular websites like mmorpg.com and mmohut.com and the general consensus there seems to be that it does not live up to the expectations of an AoE game. I guess they were screwed either way since the AoE franchise is huge and I don't think they would have ever been able to live up to the hype.

Anyway, those are my thoughts!

andreicde
10-02-2011, 05:57 AM
lol p2win cash shop?did you played the game?The units you buy there ARE NOT invincible. The resources you buy there can be EASILY acquired in game. the Wealth(influence) can be EASILY acquired also.

Sephriem
10-02-2011, 06:14 AM
lol p2win cash shop?did you played the game?The units you buy there ARE NOT invincible. The resources you buy there can be EASILY acquired in game. the Wealth(influence) can be EASILY acquired also.

We're just discussing how the few MMORTS games out there tend to end up as p2w, not saying this game will follow in the same footsteps (I actually believe it wont!)

White935
10-02-2011, 06:57 AM
I agree i doubt this game will end up as p2w due to the fact that the devs love the game themselves ( or atleast thats the impression i've got) and crowns can be aquired easily by other means.

I think i'll be buying crowns/infulnece/wealth now and then to support the develoupers thou and i hope others will too.

kyranzor
10-03-2011, 05:53 PM
Pepi18, the thing is, the way DOF works is that you can pay money to get influence and build up faster, but there is a threshold where you 'have' everything. The only thing money can buy then is faster replacement armies, and this will become extremely important when large clans/guild battles start happening. When a guild leader/accountant is spending thousands of dollars a month to keep the clan on the top of the rankings, they will dominate with special units and very fast resource recovery.

It's a means to an end, but it's not the only end. The majority of players won't even go near the shop, and only those who are truly competitive and want to 'waste' their life and money on the serious side of the game will use the market how you say it will be used. Not only that, but it will be a battle of the buyers, it will hardly ever be buyers versus non-buying players.

Pepi18
10-03-2011, 07:16 PM
Pepi18, the thing is, the way DOF works is that you can pay money to get influence and build up faster, but there is a threshold where you 'have' everything. The only thing money can buy then is faster replacement armies, and this will become extremely important when large clans/guild battles start happening. When a guild leader/accountant is spending thousands of dollars a month to keep the clan on the top of the rankings, they will dominate with special units and very fast resource recovery.

It's a means to an end, but it's not the only end. The majority of players won't even go near the shop, and only those who are truly competitive and want to 'waste' their life and money on the serious side of the game will use the market how you say it will be used. Not only that, but it will be a battle of the buyers, it will hardly ever be buyers versus non-buying players.

I guess I don't have a very good idea about how end game works in this game then. So you max out your home city, your troops and your resources and that is as far as your personal progression goes? And the cash shop will help you replenish your city, troops and resources faster?

I know this is going off topic, but what does the majority of the gameplay entail... I was assuming you kept growing within your city and somehow battling for power with other players.

kyranzor
10-03-2011, 10:06 PM
You can never permenantly lose your home city, and once it is fully built and you have finished the 'quests' which form the intro to the game, there is nothing to do but battle/seige the ai and other players. It is definitely a limited end-game. Will take a while of constant playing to get there though. In the beta i got only halfway through this process, but i quickly realised the shortfalls of endgame play. Just like what happens in games like Guild Wars when your character reaches lvl20, nothing more to do except join guilds and do battles.

GPS51
10-03-2011, 10:08 PM
Yup that's true now. It's changing over the next 3 months.

Sephriem
10-03-2011, 10:09 PM
You can never permenantly lose your home city, and once it is fully built and you have finished the 'quests' which form the intro to the game, there is nothing to do but battle/seige the ai and other players. It is definitely a limited end-game. Will take a while of constant playing to get there though. In the beta i got only halfway through this process, but i quickly realised the shortfalls of endgame play. Just like what happens in games like Guild Wars when your character reaches lvl20, nothing more to do except join guilds and do battles.

I think there's enough to do to hold someone attention over atm, it's an RTS game. There's not a whole lot of content you can add. In an RTS you just battle. It's still really early for this game and I'm sure they have things planned for the future.

Pepi18
10-03-2011, 11:58 PM
My vision of the perfect MMORTS is to have a world in which we the players fight for land and form alliances in a sandbox sort of way. I don't know if any of you have heard of War Of Legends published by Jagex which releasex over a year ago, kind of like Evony, but with some serious issues most notably of which is their evil cash shop. The fight for power and alliances in it was a really cool concept though. Also Eve Online which although it is an MMORPG sandbox, has a similar idea with a world that is controlled by the player.

I think Dawn Of Fantasy is not far off that concept but I was a little dismayed that when I opened the world map and discovered it was not a view of a player run world but of a world full of AI. I have only known this game for 3 days now and I don't know the direction it is going in, but that is certainly what my dream MMORTS should be.

The quests, AI and home town are great the way they are, but I would like to have a world map where players live and breathe together (and which expands as more players come in like Eve Online), all on one server, creating cities, forming alliances, expanding their territory (like Eve Online - so basically Eve Online meets RTS - like war of legends - and the fantasy genre :)).

kyranzor
10-04-2011, 12:14 AM
yes it was a real shame when i first realised that the players are only able to connect through a match-maker system, and that the world map is just a tiny little pre-made adventure world, which somehow fits in thousands, possibly hundreds of thousands of player cities. It's silly really. And yes, at least Evony had a landscape where people's towns are visible in scale to others.

andreicde
10-04-2011, 05:57 AM
yes it was a real shame when i first realised that the players are only able to connect through a match-maker system, and that the world map is just a tiny little pre-made adventure world, which somehow fits in thousands, possibly hundreds of thousands of player cities. It's silly really. And yes, at least Evony had a landscape where people's towns are visible in scale to others.

silly?Not really. It would be stupid to see hundreds of towns on the map and very annoying as well.

Abister
10-04-2011, 01:09 PM
I was also a little disappointed, but they may be unable to do it due to performance issues, but if it WERE like Eve meets RTS, that would be the best game ever.

BUT I am still quite content with what they have planned (I am pretty sure it's going to be like how it is now, only you see were all of the other players cities are in each region basically all on top of each other, and you choose the name from a list. Please, if I am wrong, correct me.) because I like how easy it will be to get around. But Pepi18's dream MMORTS is just like mine.

Henry Martin
10-04-2011, 01:51 PM
yes it was a real shame when i first realised that the players are only able to connect through a match-maker system, and that the world map is just a tiny little pre-made adventure world, which somehow fits in thousands, possibly hundreds of thousands of player cities. It's silly really. And yes, at least Evony had a landscape where people's towns are visible in scale to others.

Its called "Instancing". It was a design decision not to have every player visible on the same world map.

All browser games that have every player on the world map is using tiled squares that is visual representation of a list. Having a list of names or have a world map filled with names is the same thing. A lot of browser games you dont even see your army move to a town you attack, Its all "Text". Also for most you dont even get to fight your own battles, you get a message awhile later saying if you won or lost.

Pretty much everyone asking for it is just for visual stimulation. As there no gameplay affect for this that a window of text couldn't do.

Wolfentir
10-04-2011, 06:51 PM
Its called "Instancing". It was a design decision not to have every player visible on the same world map.

All browser games that have every player on the world map is using tiled squares that is visual representation of a list. Having a list of names or have a world map filled with names is the something. A lot of browser games you dont even see your army move to a town you attack, Its all "Text". Also for most you dont even get to fight your own battles, you get a message awhile later saying if you won or lost.

Pretty much everyone asking for it is just for visual stimulation. As there no gameplay affect for this that a window of text couldn't do.

But will there be wars over territory between the guilds some time in the future?

Lets say players can keep playing Online Kingdoms like they are now. They will build up their city, fight NPCs and PvP and level up their units. Then they can join a guild.

Lets say there can be 10 guilds in each region and each guild will start with 1/10 of the territory. Guild wars maps will be separate to Online Kingdom one and much simpler.

The map for guild play can be represented by coloured regions and when you click on them they will display which guilds are fighting for them, % controlled and lists with names of members of the guilds. For eg. a region might be 50% blue (human) and 50% green (elves) if only these these two guilds are fighting for the control of it.


A guild will consist of 10 players or less. According to average stats of players, their guild will be put into a certain region of the world where similiar guilds are located. Then members of guilds can fight each other (1v1, 2v2, etc) and results of fights will determine how much of the region each guild will control. Eg. all human guild members fight elven guild members and humans win by destroying 60% of the elven army (when all stats are added up from all the fights). Then human guild takes 60% of the elven territory. And all fights need to happen within a week or two (as agreed by members).


I wonder if this at least would be possible, since it was said that representing all cities and armies for all the players on one map would be impossible.

Konstantin Fomenko
10-04-2011, 08:16 PM
There will be a game mechanics with guilds controlling large NPC towns and fighting over them yes. Sorry out of time to explain the entire game mechanics, there should be a few post that explain guilds already.

Wolfentir
10-05-2011, 06:23 PM
There will be a game mechanics with guilds controlling large NPC towns and fighting over them yes. Sorry out of time to explain the entire game mechanics, there should be a few post that explain guilds already.

No worries KF. I tried searching posts on guilds and I couldn't find any official info on guilds. If anyone has a link to a post explaining how the guilds will work please let me know.

woody8917
10-05-2011, 06:40 PM
No worries KF. I tried searching posts on guilds and I couldn't find any official info on guilds. If anyone has a link to a post explaining how the guilds will work please let me know.

Here you go sir i think this is what you wanted: http://www.reverieworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4331 Posts 5 and 9

Wolfentir
10-05-2011, 06:55 PM
Here you go sir i think this is what you wanted: http://www.reverieworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4331 Posts 5 and 9

Thanks man. Still doesn't expalin guilds. Hopefully Konstantin can shed some light on it at some other time.