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Griegor Mcvennor
03-16-2011, 10:06 PM
Please correct me if I am wrong and I hope I am, but the MMO portion of this game will allow combat between players but not the ability to take over another player's lands correct?

So my question is two fold

1: Say I want a particular piece of land because I like the way it's designed but it's owned by another player. Essentially your saying that I can not own that land or take it over ever until the other player quits the game?

2: What is to stop inactive players from hoarding all the better land spots and leaving them to rot in the game world with nothing to show for it?

Yami-Yagari
03-17-2011, 04:20 AM
Please correct me if I am wrong and I hope I am, but the MMO portion of this game will allow combat between players but not the ability to take over another player's lands correct?

So my question is two fold

1: Say I want a particular piece of land because I like the way it's designed but it's owned by another player. Essentially your saying that I can not own that land or take it over ever until the other player quits the game?

2: What is to stop inactive players from hoarding all the better land spots and leaving them to rot in the game world with nothing to show for it?

No, you can't take over other people's lands. You do get substantial amount of resources should you succeed. But people's home region are instances, so they won't be there physically on the world map. Most likely they are a few random home region templates depending on which region you decide to settle, with perhaps a small variety in the amount of resources you can harvest there.

But i'm with you on this one about conquering other people. True it will be a ***** for new players, inexperienced all alone in the big, bad outdoors, but you should think about the possibilities here. For me, being able to take over other people's lands kind of sums up what would be most fun for me in endgame. This would actually create a really dynamic diplomacy in DoF. Say I were to conquer my neighbours, surely this will spook people into either allying or opposing your growing (guild)empire. You'll get players creating coalitions until finally, my economy can't support war on multiple fronts. My capitol gets taken, people get liberated, everyone happy except me :( .

It would create a more hectic endgame experience, where people ally themselves with other people, only to stab them in the back later and ultimately get forced back to square 1. I know this idea has several flaws, but it makes for entertaining gameplay. It's either that, or you'll get really big guilds who bully smaller guilds into submission by constant raiding their settlements, until finally you have huge guilds which eventually bogs down the game to a point it's pointless to play because you can't take over their strongholds and they can't take over yours. There will be no territory loss and it will result in a very long, very boring cold war.

Sarkata
03-17-2011, 11:46 AM
Seconding the desire for a hardcore mode.

Griegor Mcvennor
03-17-2011, 02:18 PM
I wouldn't directly call it a "hardcore mode". The idea of hard core drives away causal players that can be successful too. I think the best way to think of it as a mode that mirrors realistic middle age warfare.

I'd say have a sever with rules seperate from the non-conquest server that allows for Home regions and castles to be lost. If you lose your home region you keep part of the resources you had and are given the option to resettle on another continent.

To keep it fair, allow players to designate a 4-6 hour window when they can be challenged for territory control isntead of just raids for resources. If that isn't acceptable, then allow raids at any time but only allow conquest challenges when both players are online.

To prevent instances of mass Realm on Realm warfare, only allow reinforcements from players within a certain distance of the battlefield or within a certain number of provinces away.

This makes it fairer for the casuals who can't be online all the time.

darkheart
03-17-2011, 05:27 PM
Please correct me if I am wrong and I hope I am, but the MMO portion of this game will allow combat between players but not the ability to take over another player's lands correct?

So my question is two fold

1: Say I want a particular piece of land because I like the way it's designed but it's owned by another player. Essentially your saying that I can not own that land or take it over ever until the other player quits the game?

2: What is to stop inactive players from hoarding all the better land spots and leaving them to rot in the game world with nothing to show for it?

i agree with you on this one inactive players are a royal pain and since the game is a big hush hush secret i can only hope there would be some type of penalty for taking over a lower ranked player just like other games like it
as for bullying there will always be them BUT to take a nice example of how pvp can be nice is i presently play stronghold on line and others very close with allllll the hundreds of players in each there are very few that outright attack just to do it many many have been peaceful with neighbors and even to a point helpful ( mind you this is in a full pvp mode ) with some type of penalty in place it dentures others from just flat being mean to others and in its place puts strategy in its place im positive it would drive others nutz to see a batch of inactivates pop up everywhere and cant do a thing that would only drive other good players away

Dolas
03-17-2011, 06:02 PM
Since everything is instanced I believe that they have a certain number of random land masses that get created for your mane base so you can just keep on re rolling until you get the type of land that you want.

As for the taking over other player's cities thing. I do like the idea of it and that's what I liked about Tribal Wars and Evony. The only problem with it is that it gives a far greater advantage to "hardcore" players then to casuals and no company has come up with a viable solution around that. I like your ideas Griegor Mcvennor, but I believe instead of allowing a 4-6 hour window, allow only 1-2 hours and let each player choose from 4-5 different time periods (like 2-4 pm or 8-10 pm). Or you do a 4-6 hour window, but it only happens once or twice a week. I just think 4-6 hours everyday is a little much for casual players.
Also, they need to keep the rule that you can only attack players that are online, because I really don't want an AI to lose my castle, when I could easily beat the enemy otherwise ;). It will definitely be a later expansion before they ever decide to release a pvp type realm, but this is the only way that I can see it being fair for casual players as well as giving the hardcore players a take over the castle type environment.

Nojo
03-21-2011, 10:51 AM
would love to see hardcore mode

wpmaura
03-22-2011, 06:55 AM
as much as I would love to see us be able to take other peoples provinces. what happens when there is one dominating player who controls 90% of the game world ? How would you beat him

Cyroch
03-22-2011, 07:04 AM
well i think that 90% is quite impossible.
But to stop very mighty players i would suggest alliances between other players, just to give one example.

NobleIre
03-22-2011, 02:28 PM
Well, they've said that you cannot move you most likely will not be able to move your stronghold, so the idea of claiming someone else's is kindof moot. You'd be stuck at your original stronghold regardless. I'm hoping that when they said that, it didn't exclude moving to a new place and starting over with new fortifications, which it wasn't really explained in detail.

Anonimo
03-24-2011, 02:32 PM
Hiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii

Griegor Mcvennor
03-25-2011, 09:27 PM
Im still confused. The trailer said the only way to expand your kingdom is attacking other players. Yet if you can't control additional castles how can you in fact expand your kingdom?

Dawiichan
03-25-2011, 09:32 PM
Im still confused. The trailer said the only way to expand your kingdom is attacking other players. Yet if you can't control additional castles how can you in fact expand your kingdom?

I'm guessing the the spoils of the attacks. It's a shallow statement but it is technically correct. More resources lets you expand your kingdom.

Griegor Mcvennor
03-25-2011, 11:25 PM
I hope they change that at some point. It's technically an MMO but realistically players go into an RTS style game looking to crush their enemies. If you can't crush anything or take territory it essentially becomes a glorified graphical match making server.

However, that being said. It's the only glorified graphical matching making MMORTS and I will happily play it until the day they see their error of thier ways and make a conquest style server.

Dawiichan
03-25-2011, 11:48 PM
I hope they change that at some point. It's technically an MMO but realistically players go into an RTS style game looking to crush their enemies. If you can't crush anything or take territory it essentially becomes a glorified graphical match making server.

However, that being said. It's the only glorified graphical matching making MMORTS and I will happily play it until the day they see their error of thier ways and make a conquest style server.

I don't know about taking over though. DoF just doesn't seem like a game that would benefit greatly from that (even though I haven't played it yet.) I think that destroying their units and taking resources is enough to destroy them. Maybe breaking some of their buildings, but being able to take their castle spot can cause players to quit. I would prefer an active game over that. Though I must say, taking over is lots of fun nonetheless.

Griegor Mcvennor
03-26-2011, 12:48 AM
Well I would say they need a seperate server for the more conquest oriented players. It has been shown that PVP and casual PVP players rarely coexist well. Having a sever for more hard core pvp players to conquest the land and do politics and other such things will give players that want to see the results of their struggles somthing to look forward to.

Joobs
03-26-2011, 01:56 PM
With no hardcore mode it kind of defeats the purpose of MMORTS.

Would be nice if it was like the Total war* series campaign mode except online.

Only problem is that would be next to impossible.

Griegor Mcvennor
03-26-2011, 03:00 PM
well it's not impossible but certainly difficult. I'd just like to see more interaction and politics in the game that make kingdom building mean something. Here is hoping though. THey have a product that looks like a great start and it just needs time to grow.

jimehau
03-26-2011, 08:03 PM
im kinda concerned that i wont get a beta key