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Tbeaz161
04-15-2008, 03:50 PM
I have seen the infantry thread but haven't seen anything about buildings does anyone know some stuff about the buildings or what ones there will be? I heard that the dragon buildings will be built on the concept you can go inside them.

Feweh
04-15-2008, 04:32 PM
Ya i aswell am curious...

Not just dragon wise, but from my understanding you don't place "Buildings" only military structures.


Any dev's here to say anything about this...

Joseph Visscher
04-15-2008, 10:32 PM
I will not say anything about about dragons in this post, but I can give some info on the other 3 sides’ type of building buildings.

The Humans have plots and pre-built stronghold wall designed, somewhat similar to bfme1 just let repetitive. The buildings themselves will have a few upgrades and uses, but pretty basic. Military buildings will make military units, the armory makes armor upgrades, The barn can make livestock such as sheep, cows, chickens, pigs; market for trading resources, etc.
All in all Humans are in the medium, there fairly good in the starting and in late games.

The Elves are based around building buildings… around… Great Trees! Pretty simple, expect the elves are… Less dependent on resources around the map, perfect for turtlers, they have a way to generate any of the 4 resources right within their stronghold. The Great Trees pretty much act like building plots around the stronghold.
Elves’ workers refuse to cut down trees for wood, instead slowly generates wood from several other ways without the means of killing innocent trees.
All in all Elves are best for late games.

The Orcs Are able to build anywhere they are more like bfme2’s way and do not require nearly as much or if any stone because there walls and upgrades do not require it (made of wood) But from what I know, they are more dependent on eating, killing, destroying, and stealing all the resources around the map, which of course is the Orcish way of life, leave the land bare to the bone! Then make a bone neckless.
When it comes to buildings, orcs, from what I know, do not have a main building, Town center. Their walls are upgraded and built through a big temple in which you must build later on in a late game.
There are two types of workers the normal orc worker which can cut down trees and get wood or mine gold or stone(But possibibly lacks the ability to get food). And the Marauder which hunts and harvests Food from animals, he is also a bow orc for the orcs, so their a food only worker and a military archer unit.
All in all Orcs are best for taking up all the resources nearby; making a massive army, and rushing the hell out of the enemy.

Pardon me Kon or Ryan if any of this is wrong, correct me if it is.

frankein_fish
04-16-2008, 12:09 AM
Nice info there, still sticking with the Human's :rolleyes:

†TYRANICK†™
04-16-2008, 03:24 AM
Wait so...all or most of the human buildings are " pre built"? What about start bases from scratch...and building wherever you want on the map...are we limited by these "plot" things? Same for elves?

And from what you said there about upgrades, doesn't sound like theres going to be loads :(. I would of thought there would be 100's from all sorts of different buildings you have to built, but it doesn't sound like it :(.

Hmmm im getting a little worried now, i hope the game isn't going to be restrictive on where and what you can built...same for upgrades, i would of expected there to be loads.

I need more information before i start jumping to conclusions but..im a little worried now :(

Jean=A=Luc
04-16-2008, 04:55 AM
Buildings aren't "pre-built" (it was taken out of context I think), you still have to build them yourself, it's just that with humans and elves they are restricted to build plots within the village/town/stronghold radius. You still start from "scratch".

It wasn't really said how many upgrades there will be. Those "few" mentioned refer to upgrades for buildings (something like barracks lvl1 -> barracks lvl2) I think. Nevertheless, I wouldn't want masses of upgrades just for the sake of having upgrades. I'd rather have 5 meaningful upgrades than hundreds of those armor lvl1 -> armor lvl2 -> armor lvl3 etc. types.

And the building location restriction isn't so severe because you can still use army camps to secure remote locations and create forward bases for unit production which is the only thing that really matters. You'd want your economy and "tech" buildings to remain behind walls anyway.

Plus this only applies to humans and elves, others seam to have quite different systems and I for one welcome the diversity. :)

SvN
04-16-2008, 05:14 AM
I will not say anything about about dragons in this post..


why keeping the dragon faction so secret?? I don't want to know so much about any factions (more fun playing the game if you don't know everything already), but about the dragons we know nothing! nothing. Think about it, the community can't tell you what's good and what's bad with the dragons if they know nothing about them.

WearisomeWall
04-16-2008, 07:57 AM
It's a good marketing strategy. They're almost transparent about most of the aspects of the game but one, making you dying to play the game when it comes out and see that one.

†TYRANICK†™
04-16-2008, 08:46 AM
Buildings aren't "pre-built" (it was taken out of context I think), you still have to build them yourself, it's just that with humans and elves they are restricted to build plots within the village/town/stronghold radius. You still start from "scratch".

It wasn't really said how many upgrades there will be. Those "few" mentioned refer to upgrades for buildings (something like barracks lvl1 -> barracks lvl2) I think. Nevertheless, I wouldn't want masses of upgrades just for the sake of having upgrades. I'd rather have 5 meaningful upgrades than hundreds of those armor lvl1 -> armor lvl2 -> armor lvl3 etc. types.

And the building location restriction isn't so severe because you can still use army camps to secure remote locations and create forward bases for unit production which is the only thing that really matters. You'd want your economy and "tech" buildings to remain behind walls anyway.

Plus this only applies to humans and elves, others seam to have quite different systems and I for one welcome the diversity. :)

Hmmm I see that makes a bit more sense, still I'm very touchy when it comes to restrictions in RTS games, then again we could probably mod it if we desired :P.

I guess i was just thinking to broad as usual and missing the small bits heh.

Well um yeah we'd all like more info on the dragons to, but when companies says they "dont wish to disclose any information at this times" usually means 3 things:

1) They aren't done/started/ created it yet
2) There having massive problems with it and its hindering development
3) (Rarely) its gonna be so friggin epic it will blow your mind!!

Now i hope its 3 lol, but i hope more that its none of them, if ya get me :P

Ryan Zelazny
04-16-2008, 10:21 AM
Dragons are a touchy subject, yes it is part of the marketing strategy to reveal little about the 2 things we are doing uniquely in the game, which are Dragons and MMO. The other part is as Tyranic suggested, Dragons aren't finished yet.

Humans, Elves and Orcs are all playable in our current build, so all the concepts we have envisioned for them are in play and we can see that they are working and we are tweaking what doesn't. Dragons aren't playable in our build, so we could go on and on about what we plan to do with them but it would be all speculation and such until we actually try these aspects out to see if they work in the game. So we choose to not give out information that we are unsure of.

Puppeteer
04-16-2008, 12:06 PM
Good marketting strategy :)
I hope melee troops and archers will NOT be able to destroy stone structures. And archers have little impact on wooden structures, unless they have fire arrows in which case same damage but chances of catching fire which would be devastating and can spread. That would be good...

Joseph Visscher
04-16-2008, 12:50 PM
The Humans have plots and pre-built stronghold wall designed.


Prebuilt stronghold wall design means, your walls when you have enough resources and build them, will already have there set design for that map. All you have to do is push a button and watch them build around your empire. no worring how your going to connect the last wall with the first wall, no wasting time placing hundreds of wall segments.

There are many plots inside your base, you can buy more if you like for some resources, there is a limit to them because you need room for your houses which give you a higher population limit, aswell your army needs room inside your stronghold does it not?; BUT, there are still many plots outside of your stronghold for mills and farms etc, as well forward bases and camps etc.

"Get more Archers on the walls prepare for battle!"
"We cant Sir. We have a third barn blocking the ladders and the stairwells....
We need more cows!"


Good marketting strategy :)
I hope melee troops and archers will NOT be able to destroy stone structures. And archers have little impact on wooden structures, unless they have fire arrows in which case same damage but chances of catching fire which would be devastating and can spread. That would be good...

We do have several armor types and damages, so it is very much so possible to include if it is not already? :p And to my knowledge melee and archer units do literly nothing to walls.

†TYRANICK†™
04-16-2008, 01:23 PM
Wait so...you have "pre-built in" designs for all the walls on the map...and at the click of the button they all built around your base? .....:(

That's incredibly limiting...

Does that mean we cant build walls or structures anywhere else apart from in the "pre-building areas"? That means you can be easily surrounded incredibly quickly. What if you wanted to cut off and create a choke point, you cant send a builder out to go and build a wall there? (after say building friendly structure there)?

You say there are quite a few plots but, does this also apply for forward bases?

It gives me the impression that: "You HAVE to built here or no base for you" "If you dont do this...tough".

Is it some sort of balancing strategy? Because it just sounds soooo restrictive that your forced to built in conjunction with the map...i dont care if i would of had to build individual segments, hell at least it provides a lot more freedom on how you layout your defenses.

I want to be able to freely create "layers" of defenses, sever choke points, establish filtering systems, traps and use the entire area to force the sloth upon my enemy without restriction...having to abide by a built-in structure doesn't appeal to me at all.

Can you not built walls in segments as separate structures? Is it all just a button you click? "Build 135 pre-defined wall segments...will cost 800000 stone" Etc...how much will it cost to build and entire perimeter defense lol?

Unless...

Its a tactical option? You either allow us to built in predefined structures OR allow us to make our own "layouts" or "blueprints" or allow us to built and design as freely as we want.

Other thing that worries me is that this is for Men and Elves, but orcs can built freely wherever they want...but are restricted to just wooden walls?

Something really doesn't sound right...im now dreading on how restrictive play mite be :(. I think you should either revise what your planning...or convince me that there is still some "freedom" in settings up walls and defense.

Konstantin Fomenko
04-16-2008, 01:26 PM
To follow up, our Dragons are significantly different from the other 3 factions in-game. And there will be quite a bit of testing and different design approaches envolved before we can finalize the Dragon race. Until such time - and well, some marketing thoughts as well, we can`t reveal much about them.

Neotyguy40
04-16-2008, 01:39 PM
To follow up, our Dragons are significantly different from the other 3 factions in-game. And there will be quite a bit of testing and different design approaches envolved before we can finalize the Dragon race. Until such time - and well, some marketing thoughts as well, we can`t reveal much about them.

Will they at least have a special air to ground combat system?

The Witch King of Angmar
04-16-2008, 01:52 PM
I'd say yes. I'd like to know more about the wall system too.

Joseph Visscher
04-16-2008, 01:56 PM
Wait so...you have "pre-built in" designs for all the walls on the map...and at the click of the button they all built around your base? .....:(

That's incredibly limiting...

Does that mean we cant build walls or structures anywhere else apart from in the "pre-building areas"? That means you can be easily surrounded incredibly quickly. What if you wanted to cut off and create a choke point, you cant send a builder out to go and build a wall there? (after say building friendly structure there)?

You say there are quite a few plots but, does this also apply for forward bases?

It gives me the impression that: "You HAVE to built here or no base for you" "If you dont do this...tough".

Is it some sort of balancing strategy? Because it just sounds soooo restrictive that your forced to built in conjunction with the map...i dont care if i would of had to build individual segments, hell at least it provides a lot more freedom on how you layout your defenses.

I want to be able to freely create "layers" of defenses, sever choke points, establish filtering systems, traps and use the entire area to force the sloth upon my enemy without restriction...having to abide by a built-in structure doesn't appeal to me at all.

Can you not built walls in segments as separate structures? Is it all just a button you click? "Build 135 pre-defined wall segments...will cost 800000 stone" Etc...how much will it cost to build and entire perimeter defense lol?

Unless...

Its a tactical option? You either allow us to built in predefined structures OR allow us to make our own "layouts" or "blueprints" or allow us to built and design as freely as we want.

Other thing that worries me is that this is for Men and Elves, but orcs can built freely wherever they want...but are restricted to just wooden walls?

Something really doesn't sound right...im now dreading on how restrictive play mite be :(. I think you should either revise what your planning...or convince me that there is still some "freedom" in settings up walls and defense.

Quite a while ago i wanted the same thing TYRANICK, blueprint options atleast, but yes this would make a massive unknown gap in balancing.

But please remember that these are walkible walls not some unwalkible piece of **** from AOE 3 or BFME2. These walls have tons of upgrades all chosen by you to upgrade for a cost. Also there are layers of walls that you must build each costing quite a bit, and even more for upgrades, therefore there are many tactical options for you to choose, but yes, simply having walls stretching across the entire map is, out of the question. Your enemy will have the ability to surround you, and siege you, and pillage your farms unto ruin and you cower into the safety of your walls, coward humans!
Maybe you should join the Orcs.
Oh, and also, the Orcs’ walls are not built anywhere either they are prebuilt in this latest build aswell. But the buildings you can build anywhere to your liking.

We’ve thought about making the walls ‘ free style ‘ but it would simply mess up the balance to much and it wouldn’t look very good. It would lead, for more people, to not even have walls. Like it is in bfme2, just a rush game, no need for walls, ‘the game ends in 5 minutes anyways, why build walls’. Otherwise, having random walls spamed all over the place looks really stupid. and not a very good image I believe.

Goblin Archer: “Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh hahahahahahahah Stupid humans!”

Having a properly constructed stronghold with several layers of walls with trebuchets boiling oil, archer towers here and there in a nice realistic fasion holding off a massive orc army. Now that’s a image I can see in DOF!

Ovocean
04-16-2008, 03:34 PM
Sad, but I have to agree that it sounds really limitating if we don't have any choice at where the defenses (the walls) are placed. We'll probably hear players defend themselves after a defeat: "But your walls where better placed than mine, not fair!"
I hope at least that we'll be able to choose where to put the gates, the number and approximate placement of towers, etc. etc.

Sure, having everything predefined ensures that it will look perfectly good and realistic, and that the lazy players won't be annoyed by having to place every single crate by hand, but how far can it take over liberty?

Eventually, I think I will accept the fact and appreciate the realistic and epic look of the game, but I'm not sure that it will be a factor of prime appeal for most people. Or you'll really have to demonstrate very well how varied can be the stragic placements of elements on the walls and everywhere on the map.


PS: I have to admit, though, that i've been appealed at my first approach to the game by the fact that I wouldn't have to place all my buildings by hand - I'm of the lazy people in some domains -, but maybe it's going too far? I imagined that we would be able to stretch the walls a bit, don't know.
And definitely, what about the mobile camps ? Can we place them anywhere we want ? The palisades ?

Feweh
04-16-2008, 04:16 PM
I agree with what they did to a extent.


For one.

In BFME1 i loved the fact that humans and that had a wall, it was the coolest feature.

In BFME2 they destroyed the fun of walls by not making the walking on able.. and i pretty much decided screw walls they're useless.


In DoF there's walls they're pre-set but it doesnt seem as bad.

I would LOVE TO LOVE TO LOVE, be able to place my gate location, and the towers like the above person said.

But i agree to the whole ******s placing walls everywhere thing, does ruin it and the realism involved.

Tbeaz161
04-16-2008, 04:26 PM
So the walls are like strongholds were you could walk on them and everything? Also if all your walls have a predetermined place then how many layers can you have and if you could only have like 2 layers or somethin will the walls be strong? I don't want the enemy to be able to get like 10 trebuchts and kill all my guys on the walls go in with the siege ladders and take my place in like 5 seconds. Will there be something for your people to stop them from geting your walls? Like if they get a seige tower on my wall are my people able to fight onto it and over take it or knock it over or somethin?

The Witch King of Angmar
04-16-2008, 04:28 PM
Quite a while ago i wanted the same thing TYRANICK, blueprint options atleast, but yes this would make a massive unknown gap in balancing.

But please remember that these are walkible walls not some unwalkible piece of **** from AOE 3 or BFME2. These walls have tons of upgrades all chosen by you to upgrade for a cost. Also there are layers of walls that you must build each costing quite a bit, and even more for upgrades, therefore there are many tactical options for you to choose, but yes, simply having walls stretching across the entire map is, out of the question. Your enemy will have the ability to surround you, and siege you, and pillage your farms unto ruin and you cower into the safety of your walls, coward humans!
Maybe you should join the Orcs.
Oh, and also, the Orcs’ walls are not built anywhere either they are prebuilt in this latest build aswell. But the buildings you can build anywhere to your liking.

We’ve thought about making the walls ‘ free style ‘ but it would simply mess up the balance to much and it wouldn’t look very good. It would lead, for more people, to not even have walls. Like it is in bfme2, just a rush game, no need for walls, ‘the game ends in 5 minutes anyways, why build walls’. Otherwise, having random walls spamed all over the place looks really stupid. and not a very good image I believe.

Goblin Archer: “Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh hahahahahahahah Stupid humans!”

Having a properly constructed stronghold with several layers of walls with trebuchets boiling oil, archer towers here and there in a nice realistic fasion holding off a massive orc army. Now that’s a image I can see in DOF!

Do the preset walls all depend on where you build or can you only build in some spots? Also, will camps have preset walls too?

Thanks

WearisomeWall
04-16-2008, 04:33 PM
Like if they get a seige tower on my wall are my people able to fight onto it and over take it or knock it over or somethin?
I saw a ladder being knocked off of a wall in one of the screenshots, so I assume things like this can work.

†TYRANICK†™
04-16-2008, 04:36 PM
Quite a while ago i wanted the same thing TYRANICK, blueprint options atleast, but yes this would make a massive unknown gap in balancing.

But please remember that these are walkible walls not some unwalkible piece of **** from AOE 3 or BFME2. These walls have tons of upgrades all chosen by you to upgrade for a cost. Also there are layers of walls that you must build each costing quite a bit, and even more for upgrades, therefore there are many tactical options for you to choose, but yes, simply having walls stretching across the entire map is, out of the question. Your enemy will have the ability to surround you, and siege you, and pillage your farms unto ruin and you cower into the safety of your walls, coward humans!
Maybe you should join the Orcs.
Oh, and also, the Orcs’ walls are not built anywhere either they are prebuilt in this latest build aswell. But the buildings you can build anywhere to your liking.

We’ve thought about making the walls ‘ free style ‘ but it would simply mess up the balance to much and it wouldn’t look very good. It would lead, for more people, to not even have walls. Like it is in bfme2, just a rush game, no need for walls, ‘the game ends in 5 minutes anyways, why build walls’. Otherwise, having random walls spamed all over the place looks really stupid. and not a very good image I believe.

Goblin Archer: “Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh hahahahahahahah Stupid humans!”

Having a properly constructed stronghold with several layers of walls with trebuchets boiling oil, archer towers here and there in a nice realistic fasion holding off a massive orc army. Now that’s a image I can see in DOF!

Don't dis AOE3 lol, i made a mod for them to have walkable fort walls so :p on you! hehe

That all sounds very nice and i like the sound of the upgrades and you say we will have lots of different ways of putting the walls up.

And you say there walkable and fully mountable walls...well then wouldn't encouraging a little bit of "free form" with walls help with the defenses? You could build another set of defenses and wall going along a choke point or by a bridge or near a sea front...get some archers to patrol up and down...and have your segments of than wall linked to you main city walls. Allowing us to at least "build off" from predefined walls would be a better idea. Because then it would encourage use of mounted wall units, placing them across a sea free front, having them patrol up and down to spot ships or spies, then to quickly run back your base to defend, or to step down from the walls, act as a decoy for your enemy, would make for a lot of devious moments.

But...i do agree that "free style" provokes noob spamming....hmmm.

Also...no offense to the next part...but...

By the way you say "mess up the balance to much and it wouldn’t look very good. It would lead, for more people, to not even have walls. Like it is in bfme2, just a rush game, no need for walls, ‘the game ends in 5 minutes anyways, why build walls’. Otherwise, having random walls spammed all over the place looks really stupid. and not a very good image"

Dude...we're not all idiots who just spam walls and go "OH NO3S DEMZ GUY GOT DA ARMY AMZA GUNa BUILT t3h wall in iz face lolz so he cnt getz ma base, har har u gotz t3h pwnzord by mez wall 1337 shiz"

I for one, like having at least some freedom, because i believe that strongholds are NOT made to the absolute maximum defense, with just 1 outer perimeter of predefined neatly set up walls...YES! IT DOES! make it look awesome...BUT its "limiting".

I would TOTALLY support if you added in a feature for us to "break off" and expand our defenses with a little bit of freedom.

And saying it would lead people to rush? Lol no it wouldn't at all! Not with all the awesome features you say the walls will have. you seem to not like bfme2 lol...i didn't really, but never had a problem with rushers that much...mordor just pwned.

Hmmmm...

OH!! A SOLUTION!!

How about making free-style limited to single player and skirmish and keep the normal predefined for online play? That way you got the best of both worlds then...maybe some kind of option in skirmish mode "predefined structures...or *frees style* structures".

At least consider thinking about it? For me that would solve this worry 100% :D

Principal is entirely sound for MMO play, regular skirmish and single player, give us an option of either or maybe even both styles.

Oh and yeah...as long as we can place our gates and towers and other defenses where we want too will also make it a bit better :).

Tbeaz161
04-16-2008, 04:46 PM
I've been hearing alot of choke points what are those? Also I was wondering if we could get a general idea of how far you are into completion if you know. Then we would know if you were actually able to put some of the stuff in we are suggesting without holding it back like 6 months :P. The Predetermined thing sounds pretty cool to me becasue it sounds like there will be some variety and I want to play it before I dis it. Also will what region you pick for your race to start in determine your town set up? Also I have an awesome idea for the undead... BONE WALLS! :D ok maybe it wasn't THAT awesome you decide :)

†TYRANICK†™
04-16-2008, 04:50 PM
I've been hearing alot of choke points what are those? Also I was wondering if we could get a general idea of how far you are into completion if you know. Then we would know if you were actually able to put some of the stuff in we are suggesting without holding it back like 6 months :P. The Predetermined thing sounds pretty cool to me becasue it sounds like there will be some variety and I want to play it before I dis it. Also will what region you pick for your race to start in determine your town set up? Also I have an awesome idea for the undead... BONE WALLS! :D ok maybe it wasn't THAT awesome you decide :)

Bone walls would be awesome for undead, but no undead till next DoF or expansion lol

Choke point? Well imagine a bottle neck of troops, sorta like that, somewhere where a defensive advantage could make you succeed or nearly succeed overwhelming odds (Example the film 300 :D <3 300 hehe)

Sure it "can" be cool...but I'd need to experience it my self first.

Also... what do people think of my compromise?

Tbeaz161
04-16-2008, 04:54 PM
That sounds intresting there might be balance issues although (not that I think there is I don't really know anything about that stuff:p )

†TYRANICK†™
04-16-2008, 04:57 PM
That sounds intresting there might be balance issues although (not that I think there is I don't really know anything about that stuff:p )

Heh well you have to utilise them effectively of course. Not unbalancing because if your enemy has control over one of those points (or several) then your kinda screwed if you want to go on the offensive heh. Buts its rare so d/w. RTS's aren't souly about map dominance.

Anyway, skirmish "free style"? +1 good idea IMO. since then your only harming an AI hehe.

Feweh
04-16-2008, 05:00 PM
In Age of Empires 3 you could like build 20 layers of walls all close to eachother.

Kinda killed the fun if you ask me, not only that but when you look at it it looks stupid.



Anyways this is usually the part where the CEO/Producer shows us a screenshot of something cool and we all drop the topic and talk about how amazing something is.

†TYRANICK†™
04-16-2008, 05:03 PM
In Age of Empires 3 you could like build 20 layers of walls all close to eachother.

Kinda killed the fun if you ask me, not only that but when you look at it it looks stupid.



Anyways this is usually the part where the CEO/Producer shows us a screenshot of something cool and we all drop the topic and talk about how amazing something is.

Haha yeah that's what im hoping for :p

Of course spamming them in most RTS kills the fun for you opponent but...dont you think we should at least maybe have some sort of option of freedom? Even if its just for skirmish like if said...4 time now lol xD

Feweh
04-16-2008, 05:34 PM
Haha yeah that's what im hoping for :p

Of course spamming them in most RTS kills the fun for you opponent but...dont you think we should at least maybe have some sort of option of freedom? Even if its just for skirmish like if said...4 time now lol xD



As long as theres more than a two players fighting in skirmish i'm good with it.

Problem with free buulding walls is that there's always some turds that will build walls everywhere!!

As long as the pre-set system is good i'm fine with it.

Tbeaz161
04-16-2008, 05:36 PM
Building walls everywhere doesn't sound like a good strategy if they do that it sounds like it wouldn't be that hard to own there ass. Of course that would be that fun :(

Neotyguy40
04-16-2008, 06:19 PM
I will not say anything about about dragons in this post...

Nooooooooo!!! Why is it that everywhere I go, I can't find anything about the dragon sect... I just want to know what they look like...

Joseph Visscher
04-16-2008, 06:38 PM
A tiny bit down this forum page you can see the dragon concepts

http://www.rtscommunity.com/forums/index.php?topic=3939.msg72259#msg72259

The Witch King of Angmar
04-16-2008, 07:02 PM
Their units look fierce.

†TYRANICK†™
04-17-2008, 01:33 AM
@ few and tbeaz

Well yeah thats what i mean, leave it offline and for skimish for those that ***** like me haha. And yeah, show us more of these formations that are prebiult.

I mean if there's like 10 or 15 different ones then that would be pretty good, but if theres like 3 then...i dunno :P

Again with the dragons, there not done yet/enough to be properly showcased yet :p

Puppeteer
04-17-2008, 11:08 AM
I have 4 things:
1a). I agree that during game there should be preset walls. To me it makes sense, but there should be a variety of designs you could choose from. This way you have many designs adapted to each style of gameplay. You could choose from designs that cut off choke points, or, if you want to go offensive most of the time a small 1 layer might suffice. Be stupid to, but you know. Of course, the designs would have to be specific for each map but of course in patches you might add more ;)
b). In bfme2 they intended that you could build walkable walls, but it looked silly as they were too big so when you built them they dwarfed the base itself and were too large for the interface. Lies I know hehehe but it makes sense. Also, for realism, building walls that big would take time. A heck of a lot of time. In AOE3 the walls just plain sucked though. And to build walls across a map would require a heck of a lot of stone, correct me if I'm wrong. Only a noob opponent would allow that to happen.
c). Maybe add a tool whereby the players can design their own walls and defences. Perhaps a blueprint, or like in a map editor you build it from a selection of wall objects. Then you group them and save the template, thus when you go online/offline you can choose that preset instead. Depending on how many pieces you use and what pieces you use the cost would vary. That would solve many problems.
d). The idea of Bone Walls? Too cliché and I don't think would look to good. Would be in stark contrast to the environment, these mottled unstable garishly white walls, and wouldn't look too good. Enchanted dark stone, with veins of dark blood would be nice, or something like that.

(my longest essay here to date, and it's not even that long! :D)

The Witch King of Angmar
04-17-2008, 02:32 PM
I have 4 things:
1a). I agree that during game there should be preset walls. To me it makes sense, but there should be a variety of designs you could choose from. This way you have many designs adapted to each style of gameplay. You could choose from designs that cut off choke points, or, if you want to go offensive most of the time a small 1 layer might suffice. Be stupid to, but you know. Of course, the designs would have to be specific for each map but of course in patches you might add more ;)
b). In bfme2 they intended that you could build walkable walls, but it looked silly as they were too big so when you built them they dwarfed the base itself and were too large for the interface. Lies I know hehehe but it makes sense. Also, for realism, building walls that big would take time. A heck of a lot of time. In AOE3 the walls just plain sucked though. And to build walls across a map would require a heck of a lot of stone, correct me if I'm wrong. Only a noob opponent would allow that to happen.
c). Maybe add a tool whereby the players can design their own walls and defences. Perhaps a blueprint, or like in a map editor you build it from a selection of wall objects. Then you group them and save the template, thus when you go online/offline you can choose that preset instead. Depending on how many pieces you use and what pieces you use the cost would vary. That would solve many problems.
d). The idea of Bone Walls? Too cliché and I don't think would look to good. Would be in stark contrast to the environment, these mottled unstable garishly white walls, and wouldn't look too good. Enchanted dark stone, with veins of dark blood would be nice, or something like that.

(my longest essay here to date, and it's not even that long! :D)

What you said about creating your own walls almost reminds me of in Roller Coaster Tycoon 2 how there was a program to create your own ride then implement your design into the game. Therefore, the bigger the wall, the more expensive it could be.

welshie
04-18-2008, 02:22 AM
bit disapointed in not being alowed crazy with walls but better to have a nice looking city with good looking defences rather thanone that looks like a toddler made :D meh will give me more time getting a bigger army more resources and eating human/orc/elfs and not worring about 'ohhh is there a gap in my lovly wall'

As for bone walls, that would be a bit umm how shall we say it cornie. Id rather have a stone one anyway because im sure bone will disintegrate therefor being useless :D unless u replace them bones everyday and look after ur wall, but thats less time for destroying noobs :D

Puppeteer
04-18-2008, 10:25 AM
Yeah too corny definitely, Revier are too clever and innovative to use that...

LordSlayer
04-18-2008, 03:09 PM
Bone walls would definetly not work. They would take way to long to build, would be incredibly hard to repair (unless you have big piles of bones in your base) and bone isn't really that strongs, so you would have to spend half your life fixing them.

Ovocean
04-18-2008, 03:22 PM
Yeah too corny definitely, Revier are too clever and innovative to use that...
Hmm. A fantasy setting with humans, elves, orcs and dragons... even for a game started in 2001, that's not innovative at all. I'm not sure they will manage to avoid all the clichés. :)

Tbeaz161
04-18-2008, 03:24 PM
aww everyone ganged up on my bone walls idea :p maybe walls covered in blood?:)

Puppeteer
04-19-2008, 05:41 AM
Hmm, would be too red. Veins of blood IMO would be good as it would predominantly leave dark walls.

The Witch King of Angmar
04-19-2008, 06:27 AM
I'd just go for the black walls.

Axal01
04-19-2008, 06:36 AM
Green walls for me! :D

Neotyguy40
04-19-2008, 11:26 AM
Green walls for me! :D

Colored walls? Man, they think of EVERYTHING!

jackeeboi
04-19-2008, 12:10 PM
lol ill have blue and white walls :P

Feweh
04-19-2008, 12:32 PM
I'm fine with black walls, or like dark black stone walls.

LordSlayer
04-19-2008, 02:07 PM
I hope we'll be able to import custom skins for the walls (just imagine the possibilities :rolleyes: )

Puppeteer
04-20-2008, 02:00 PM
That's what a mod's for...

Neotyguy40
04-20-2008, 09:44 PM
Ohh great... People are gonna make their town look inaproppriate.

Puppeteer
04-21-2008, 10:26 AM
It's not like they're gonna add Maison Derrieres... (mental note)

The Witch King of Angmar
04-21-2008, 01:42 PM
Maybe it could only be limited to certain designs.

LordSlayer
04-21-2008, 01:55 PM
Maybe it could only be limited to certain designs.

I agreed, people would get carried away if they aren't restricted.

Tbeaz161
04-22-2008, 11:52 AM
"Hello Kitty walls!"-good example of being carried away lol :p

Neotyguy40
04-22-2008, 02:46 PM
Some people might want to make there city have alpha walls and blend into their area...

Incase some people don't know, alpha is how invisible a texture is.

Just whip up an invisible PNG with photoshop and BAM!!! Clear walls and buildings...

Liljagare
04-23-2008, 02:30 AM
Having anything "pre-designed" on the maps, how you can build etc, thats a huuuuuuge warning sign right there on locking the players.

Besides, the maps will look the same each time you play, as far as city placement goes?

Or, do I need my coffee? :D

LordSlayer
04-23-2008, 04:54 PM
Besides, the maps will look the same each time you play

The maps are goign to be randomly generated based on the faction your playing :cool:

Neotyguy40
04-23-2008, 06:30 PM
The maps are goign to be randomly generated based on the faction your playing :cool:

Nope, only humans. They said that humans buildings will have randomly generated plots... Although they never said the other ones wouldn't either...

LordSlayer
04-24-2008, 03:16 PM
Nope, only humans. They said that humans buildings will have randomly generated plots... Although they never said the other ones wouldn't either...

I never mentionned buildings, I was talking about the actual map.

Neotyguy40
04-24-2008, 10:28 PM
I thought the maps were going to stay the same each time, where did you see that?

LordSlayer
04-25-2008, 02:11 PM
I thought the maps were going to stay the same each time, where did you see that?

I bealive it was on this forum. I think someone from reverie said it.

Neotyguy40
04-25-2008, 02:29 PM
I bealive it was on this forum. I think someone from reverie said it.

That sounds very nice, much better then what I thought of (it had alot to do with the lobby).

Diggz
04-26-2008, 01:30 PM
Blueprints would not work for this game.

The preset is defined for the terrain! meaning if you made a blueprint and tried it on a mountain you'd have a wall going off cliffs!

But i do think bone walls, if coupled with bone buildings, would work for undead.

And maybe the higher tiered wall upgrades do feature multiple layers? This would be feasible on grasslands or plains where theres no terrain obstructions...

And judging by the gamespot screenshots, there is ample space inside a castle. (its an aerial view) Crowded, but ample. So beautifully medieval!

Puppeteer
04-26-2008, 02:54 PM
Goes back to the idea of "building a template in a map editor and adding it" then

LordSlayer
04-27-2008, 06:17 AM
But i do think bone walls, if coupled with bone buildings, would work for undead.

Maybe they could be used as a low level wall (instead of wooden walls) but I think they should definetly have really evil looking black stone walls radiating dark energy.

Puppeteer
04-27-2008, 02:14 PM
Look at this image on the main website, notice the suspended drawbridge type thing? Looks good!

http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/406/dof1ra9.jpg

nickson104
07-13-2008, 05:17 AM
Yeah the prebuilt looks cool, and stops spamming of walls but there IS a lack of freedom, the freebuild in stronghold i loved, making a motte and bailey or making a concentric castle, make it square or rounded...

And yeah the chokepoints would be good
I have always wanted to make a remake of the Hu Lao Gate from Dynasty Warriors in dynasty warriors 5 (not before those versions were lacking) I would just love to have the main entrance to the castle heavily guarded and a small mountainy back entrance with a small gate near the end of the canyon.... (and filled with traps :))

Joseph Visscher
07-13-2008, 09:55 AM
Yeah the prebuilt looks cool, and stops spamming of walls but there IS a lack of freedom, the freebuild in stronghold i loved, making a motte and bailey or making a concentric castle, make it square or rounded...


And having the walls destroyed by 1 swordsman in about 15 seconds....

'chop chop chop, every swing brings the walls down a brick!' :confused:

To me, Walls in that game where completely useless, enemies could destroy them like they where butter on a mid summer day. (atleast the wooden ones,,, like,,, 5 pokes from a pike man and there gone....?)

nickson104
07-13-2008, 10:14 AM
And having the walls destroyed by 1 swordsman in about 15 seconds....

'chop chop chop, every swing brings the walls down a brick!' :confused:

To me, Walls in that game where completely useless, enemies could destroy them like they where butter on a mid summer day. (atleast the wooden ones,,, like,,, 5 pokes from a pike man and there gone....?)

yup that was annoying, but i liked to make them anyway ^^ it looked cool :) except you got really p****d off when your masterpiece that took 20 minutes to make is destroyed in front of your eyes in mere minutes

Puppeteer
07-13-2008, 12:33 PM
I always wanted to make a nice castle, but would run out of stone so would have some amazing section which functioned well... then a single-layer wooden wall =(

nickson104
07-13-2008, 01:39 PM
yup thats why i first built a functioning defense then went elaborate :)