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Konstantin Fomenko
03-19-2008, 09:21 AM
Gentlemen,

As promised this week we are back with more media and showcases for you. This time lets look at something different - Dawn of Fantasy as MMORTS. While DoF does deliver on the single-player front with a full-feature single-player campaign and skirmish mode, lets state this for the record - mmorts is what Dawn of Fantasy is all about. It was our decision to try and bring a solid presentation both online and offline - but you`ll be the judge of how well we managed that - this summer.

Meanwhile, having to keep majority of MMORTS features secret until the beta stage there is still quite a bit that we can share. Over the next couple of weeks we`ll have a 4 part showcase of Character Creation process.

Konstantin Fomenko
03-19-2008, 09:39 AM
I am sure all of us have went through countless character creation screens in the past. be it WoW, Everquest, maybe even BftME 2. Your online experience in DoF will start exactly the same way - with creating your character – in our case, your city.

After choosing your race, you`ll be free to select where on the world map you would like to start - choosing your visual surrounding and gameplay style with it. This might seem like a minor decision - would my city be in a desert or in a swamp? But reality is - you`ll be choosing one of 9 sub-races. Due to the nature of different regions your gameplay experience with the same race with greatly vary.

For example - if you play as Orcs of the Desert - with no wood and no food around, but great many gold deposits, and huge bonus to looting enemy corpses and buildings, and much cheaper cavalry - you’ll most likely play as aggressive horde, raiding green territories of the north to make due, using mostly cavalry and infantry - as these require gold to build.

Now - if you’ll play as Men of the Grassland - a green pasture land with rivers and forests, but almost no gold deposits - you`ll have great food gathering economy, with all the pasture and farming bonuses, but due to the lack of gold, you`ll be forced to use great many ranged units - which would both make you great at defending your stronghold, or laying siege to the enemy, but quite bad with the open field battles.

Now, lets start by looking at 3 human regions available to the player.

Konstantin Fomenko
03-19-2008, 09:44 AM
Bellow are shots from the character creation menu - region selection for the race of Men. I am including some stats about each region - however, I`ll only mention economic changes, and leave out all the variations in research, upgrades, unit and building prices and availability.


Men of The Southmount - Alpine Region.
Large amounts of forested areas, but half these areas are not accessible due to cliffs. Good number of gold - 8, and over the top stone mines - 16. Almost no open space on the map – natural defences and choke points. No hunting opportunities. No farm land.
-Sheep fattening / generation rate + 50%
-Stone gathering rate + 35%
-Pig and Cow fattening / generation rate - 40%
-All Upgrades and Research - 35% cost

Southmont players have by far the best Strongholds. Abundance of stone mines allows creating best fortifications and fully upgrading them. Having to concentrate on sheep herding, and good access to gold mines, player is able to turtle-up, quest, research and prosper.

http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/MMO1/1.jpg



Men of The Rollingplain - Great Plains Region.

Almost no forest, plenty of gold mines – 12, some stone mines – 4. Lots of open space on the map, but limited hunting opportunities - 4 deer hordes.
-Gold Mining rate + 25%
-Wood Gathering rate – 15%
-Cow, sheep, pig fattening / generation rate – 35%
-Farming gathering Rate – 20%

Having to turn towards gold-based economy Rollingplain players will user cavalry and infantry as the backbone of their army. Lack of ranged units will create some difficulty with sieges, but Rollingplain riders will top any cavalry of the world. Slow to build and expand the city, due to lack of wood, player will be easily able to raise a stone stronghold.

http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/MMO1/2.jpg



Men of The Wold - Grassland Region.

Lots of forested areas, some gold mines – 4, and almost no stone mines – 2. Some open space on the map, great hunting opportunities – 12 deer hordes.
-Wood Gathering +30%
-Cow, sheep, pig fattening / generation rate + 35%
-Farming gathering Rate + 20%
-Hunting Rate + 40%
-Gold & Stone Mining rate - 25%

Wold players will rely on strong economy and ranged units. Easy to expand the city and raise palisade walls, lack of stone slows down castle building. However, great wood income and significant ranged combat bonuses, makes this player best with offensive siege warfare. However, grassland woods filled with mighty Wold archers and rangers will prove to be a great defensive combination as well.

http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/MMO1/3.jpg

Jean=A=Luc
03-19-2008, 10:04 AM
Awesome. Thanks for the thorough update. :)

The mountainous regions seams imba: great stone/gold mining bonuses, strong defensive position (looks almost impervious to ground assault), low upgrade costs. Even its supposed weakness is somewhat compensated by the enhanced sheep herding. Although the food penalty (no hunting, no farming) is immense, that's the key I suppose.

Btw, shouldn't it be goats? Goats are th ones who are accustomed to hilly terrain, ship are more like other plains adapted livestock. Maybe I'm wrong. On second thought I probably am. :p

Will there be trading options? Something like the classical Age of Empires market where you can exchange surplus resources for more needed ones? Or maybe the trading should be done between players?

Konstantin Fomenko
03-19-2008, 10:21 AM
Well - mountain goats would fit better. However, sheep provide slow income of gold thorugh the trade of fleece and Southmount players can use that extra boost for researching and upgrading as well as the food income from sheep.

And sure - Southmount players are a safe bet for defensive players, someone who wants to take it easy, build up, research, do a fare deal of questing, and be sure he`s safe against other players attacks. Real Turtle here.

However, it’ll take Southmount player a great deal longer before he`ll have a strong enough army to successfully wage war against fellow players and acquire new territory.

crex719
03-19-2008, 11:59 AM
This is really good because I am a habitually defensive player and these choke points can help out alot.
wait...what did you mean aquiring new territory?

Jean=A=Luc
03-19-2008, 01:35 PM
I didn't know sheep can also produce gold that way. It's pretty neat. :)

On the other hand Men of The Rollingplain only have a decent gold bonus (and a lot of open space which seams to be a kind of a resource in itself) but many penalties and they also seam to be quite vulnerable to attack...maybe.

I may have noticed an irony. Those who are rich with important resources like the Southmount people are at the same time the most difficult to attack while those who are more vulnerable don't have that much that's worth stealing (not that they're poor or anything).

Also of the two factions who live in the "flat" regions one has more gold and some stone but is low on food and wood while the other is its economic opposite.

So I see a situation like this: Rollingplane and The Wold raid each other for resources they lack while the "highlanders" have a quieter time, sitting, building up and watching the other two pwn each other but so as not to be imba their severe food shortage make it hard for them to mount an offensive. Humans aren't the only race of course but I expect others will have similar resource differences.

Oh yeah, I too am curious about that "territory acquisition" and "questing" too. But I guess that's meant for another time. :)

frankein_fish
03-19-2008, 02:31 PM
I've said it before and im gonna say it again, im gonna get a heart attack.
and my blood preasure is sky high right now

jap88
03-19-2008, 10:35 PM
Wasn't expecting subraces, it's a nice surprise after a relative period of silence.

The Witch King of Angmar
03-20-2008, 07:58 AM
I like them all but Men of The Wold are my favorite. They have decent forts, there resources are ok, and they are stealthy. I don't like the Men of The Southmont only because I hate turtling. But that's just my opinion. Keep up the awesome work guys, these screens are much appreciated.

The Witch King of Angmar
03-20-2008, 07:59 AM
I like them all but Men of The Wold are my favorite. They have decent forts, there resources are ok, and they are stealthy. I don't like the Men of The Southmont only because I hate turtling. But that's just my opinion. Keep up the awesome work guys, these screens are much appreciated.

The Witch King of Angmar
03-20-2008, 07:59 AM
I like them all but Men of The Wold are my favorite. They have decent forts, there resources are ok, and they are stealthy. I don't like the Men of The Southmont only because I hate turtling. But that's just my opinion. Keep up the awesome work guys, these screens are much appreciated.

Jean=A=Luc
03-20-2008, 09:20 AM
Whoa Which King, you should make a documentary called "When post editing goes horribly wrong". I've heard of double posts but this is like a quintuple one. :D

The Witch King of Angmar
03-20-2008, 10:28 AM
Wow that's awkward. The forums froze on me and I clicked the submit post button like 100 times. Sorry for the 4 or 5 posts. :D

Jean=A=Luc
03-20-2008, 11:34 AM
Yeah, I figured that's what happened, the forum has been loading kinda slowly lately.

But some moderation really wouldn't hurt on occasions like this. It's still pretty funny. :p

iceblast
03-20-2008, 02:25 PM
really nice screenshots

Puppeteer
03-20-2008, 02:30 PM
you need to put a warning for those with heart problems at the start of the thread :) that's awesome, ingenuitive work; I can't wait to get my hands on this!

Jean=A=Luc
03-20-2008, 02:53 PM
A lot of us seam to have heart problems. You hear that Reverie? If you don't finish the game in time our premature deaths will be on your consciousness.:eek:

The Witch King of Angmar
03-20-2008, 09:08 PM
I really like how the forts are very rural looking and how the other is right in the mountains.

crex719
03-20-2008, 10:34 PM
Yay! This game is gonna be gr *bleh*... *waits to be rez'd by new info*

Darvin
03-21-2008, 03:02 PM
Interesting system, although I do notice that each of these is an economic edge. While I dislike "strong pikes" or "strong archer" subfactions which just facilitate players who try to overwhelm with one type of unit, I think more variety is required.

For instance, one potential option might be faster build speeds with a disadvantage of slightly weaker buildings (a good combination with an improved wood gathering trait). The obvious implications would be that your buildings would be easier to destroy, but also easier to replace once destroyed, giving a different feel and potentially a different strategy to that subfaction's base.

As I said, I'm deeply opposed to making any faction an "archer specialist" or "swordsman specialist" faction, as this just encourages players to dedicate to one unit type, something that should always be avoided. It's one thing to give a faction superior wood gathering to fuel high-wood cost units, but the bottom line is that those units won't be any superior to the other player's.

The Witch King of Angmar
03-21-2008, 04:50 PM
Hopefully the factions units will not be overpowered and there regular units like swordsman will still be an average unit. Like Darvin said, the specialty units could cost more or their benefits would not imbalance battles or other things. For example maybe a group that specializes in archers could have a better chance of hitting their target but have slower reload times so that regular archers could have a "chance" of defeating them.

Darvin
03-22-2008, 12:00 AM
I strongly believe that any advantage should be paired with a corresponding disadvantage to change the way that a unit is used, and not the overall quality of the unit. If you're just varying the overall quality, then the design plays into the hands of people who want to just ride over an enemy with one very upgraded unit type. If you vary the way that the unit is used, it will not have the same effect. As I mentioned, giving an increased build time to structures, but reduced hit points, would not make them better or worse in an overall sense, but would instead change the way they are used. I feel this is the best way to create subfactions.

Konstantin Fomenko
03-22-2008, 03:06 PM
Guys, keep in mind that descriptions of advantages we posted barely scratched the surface of economic modifiers.

I strongly believe that any advantage should be paired with a corresponding disadvantage
Exactly our approach - we will reveal more details in the future.

And to address the concern that it looks like choosing a region (and later national trait - similar to mmorpg professions) can greatly increase player`s proficiency with some units - ranged and siege for Wold for example, or cavalry and melee for Rollingplains player. This is quite a standard approach seen in mmorpg - warrior class, nuker, healer e.t.c When it comes to team battles in DoF, quite often we will see players team up against other player, or quest mission, and in such situation the most successful team we`ll be a well balanced one - for example Rollingplains player will provide infantry, start a game with a nice cavalry rush, another elven player with focus in magic, will act as healing and magic support, and once it comes to laying siege to enemy stronghold, Wold player will do his part. But anyhow - the topic of professions and balancing is still to come.

Coming up on Tuesday - 3 Elven regions.

frankein_fish
03-22-2008, 03:33 PM
Coming up on Tuesday - 3 Elven regions.

:eek: Nice, looking forward to it :rolleyes:

crex719
03-22-2008, 04:00 PM
Ahh nice new info there can't wait...*rez'd*

Jean=A=Luc
03-22-2008, 04:54 PM
The mmo aspect of DoF is obviously more elaborate than I (we?) thought. I still can't figure out how exactly is it supposed to work. But I like what I'm seeing. :)

ps: Is it Tuesday already? :p

pps: How about now? :D

frankein_fish
03-23-2008, 04:08 AM
ps: Is it Tuesday already? :p
pps: How about now? :D

Well im sorry to say it's only saturday now :(

frankein_fish
03-23-2008, 04:08 AM
ps: Is it Tuesday already? :p
pps: How about now? :D

Well im sorry to say it's only saturday now :(

frankein_fish
03-23-2008, 04:09 AM
ooops sorry for the duoble post's

The Witch King of Angmar
03-23-2008, 12:01 PM
I can't wait to see the 3 Dragon factions.

frankein_fish
03-25-2008, 06:44 AM
Nah im not that thrilled about the dragons im more up to orks :P

Puppeteer
03-28-2008, 05:42 PM
I thought the human faction was eye candy enough!

Sharku
03-31-2008, 05:23 PM
I noticed that none of these have any ship bonuses...:(

supagu
03-31-2008, 10:10 PM
this game has boats??? o.0

Darvin
03-31-2008, 11:54 PM
I noticed that none of these have any ship bonuses...:(

The problem with ship bonuses (I'm actually worried about wood, now that you've brought this up) is that it gives a specific faction a very strong advantage in watery environments. While accelerated lumber harvesting will help both in high and low lumber environments, an advantage to naval combat will provide no benefit to land-locked areas. The problem here is a faction could be overpowered in one instance and underpowered in another simply based on their naval advantages which apply and don't apply in certain cases. This can cause a serious balance headache, so it's for the best to keep naval combat out of such matters. That said, changing lumber harvest rates could effectively produce the same issue, presuming lumber is the primary resource involved in navies. Therefor lumber consumption would be higher than normal on such maps, favouring subfactions with such an edge.

In this case, it might actually work if factions with reduced lumber income got a bonus to their ships to counter-act this, but this is a dangerous area to tread for reasons I've already explained.

Sharku
04-01-2008, 03:43 PM
The problem with ship bonuses (I'm actually worried about wood, now that you've brought this up) is that it gives a specific faction a very strong advantage in watery environments. While accelerated lumber harvesting will help both in high and low lumber environments, an advantage to naval combat will provide no benefit to land-locked areas. The problem here is a faction could be overpowered in one instance and underpowered in another simply based on their naval advantages which apply and don't apply in certain cases. This can cause a serious balance headache, so it's for the best to keep naval combat out of such matters. That said, changing lumber harvest rates could effectively produce the same issue, presuming lumber is the primary resource involved in navies. Therefor lumber consumption would be higher than normal on such maps, favouring subfactions with such an edge.

In this case, it might actually work if factions with reduced lumber income got a bonus to their ships to counter-act this, but this is a dangerous area to tread for reasons I've already explained.
But sub-factions are chosen by which region the first town is settled in, so in the event that there is a landlocked map a sea-faring sub-faction wouldn't even be available. Unless I'm completely wrong on this and you can choose your sub-faction no matter the environment.

Chromatism
04-02-2008, 02:51 AM
Urge to salivate... rising!

I'll admit it, I probably ain't going to play humans. I just seem to have this druidic, paganistic outlook on life with I think puts me squarely in line with the Elves.

And shamefully, I must admit that I instantly lept at the Men of Southmount! Yes I like to take my time, really build up something grand, then inevitably weep as my lack of combat experience gets it annihilated despite the amount of natural choke defence.

Though on reflection... (again, due to Druidic, Paganistic inklings) I think Men of the Wold would suit better. Just a case of breaking through, getting into an offensive siege and giving your opponent (s) hell!

I will stop saying this soon, but for now... Awesome stuff!

borbask
04-02-2008, 07:50 AM
the castle of the alpine region seems to be well defendable.:):D

LordSlayer
04-18-2008, 06:34 PM
I guess alpine humain faction is great for turtlers, but they don't seem to have a great early game offensive potential.

The Witch King of Angmar
04-18-2008, 07:32 PM
Will there be just basic faction units or will they all be from 1 of the 3 factions?

Thanks

Neotyguy40
04-18-2008, 09:10 PM
Well, I guess we can all tell how good this game will be :)

LordSlayer
04-19-2008, 04:21 PM
We will there be just basic faction units or will they all be from 1 of the 3 factions?

Thanks

I don't understand what your asking, could you plz clarify your question?

The Witch King of Angmar
04-19-2008, 08:19 PM
Ok, will men have other units that are available that are not of 1 of the 3 subfactions? For example Men of The Rollingplain will have good calvalry but does the regular Men army have regular calvalry always available not of the sub-factions?

Axal01
04-19-2008, 08:40 PM
Men of the Southmount alpine region here I come Muwhahahaha. I will prosper and then dominate!

frankein_fish
04-20-2008, 01:38 AM
Stealing my idea huh? :eek:

Neotyguy40
04-20-2008, 10:34 PM
I'm going to the dragon realms, I'm gonna capture every dragon city and become the master of dragons.

LordSlayer
04-21-2008, 03:23 PM
I'm going to the dragon realms, I'm gonna capture every dragon city and become the master of dragons.

Until I come, stab you in the back, steal your crown and get the best back armour to stop people from backstabbing me :D

Neotyguy40
04-21-2008, 09:14 PM
Too late, I have the best back armor!

LordSlayer
04-23-2008, 06:06 PM
Too late, I have the best back armor!

Ill make a time machine, go in the past and kill you just after your born :D

Neotyguy40
04-23-2008, 07:32 PM
Ill make a time machine, go in the past and kill you just after your born :D

Too late! I got the time machine and killed you!:p

LordSlayer
04-24-2008, 04:24 PM
Too late! I got the time machine and killed you!:p

How do you know when I was born to kill me in the past?
Maybee I just suddenly appeared out of nowhere :eek: :D

Neotyguy40
04-24-2008, 11:30 PM
How do you know when I was born to kill me in the past?
Maybee I just suddenly appeared out of nowhere :eek: :D

I got a DNA tracker :D

Puppeteer
04-25-2008, 01:38 PM
Hey Hey! Enough with the spam! This is about some heart-stopping screens, not some time manipulator! Shoo!

Neotyguy40
04-25-2008, 03:17 PM
Hey Hey! Enough with the spam! This is about some heart-stopping screens, not some time manipulator! Shoo!

Ahh yes... I almost forgot... Is there any more screens coming up soon?

LordSlayer
04-25-2008, 03:22 PM
Ahh yes... I almost forgot... Is there any more screens coming up soon?

On reverie's website they said they'd update the site with new screens every thursday.

The Witch King of Angmar
04-25-2008, 03:31 PM
Yeah I'd like to see some night screens.

LordSlayer
04-25-2008, 03:32 PM
Yeah I'd like to see some night screens.

Same here. Wounder how flamming arrows would work as far as providing illumination for other ranged troops :rolleyes:

The Witch King of Angmar
04-25-2008, 03:33 PM
It may. Torches will do this also. I'd expect elves would be extremely stealthy at night.

LordSlayer
04-25-2008, 03:37 PM
It may. Torches will do this also. I'd expect elves would be extremely stealthy at night.

as long as you don't set their forest on fire :D

The Witch King of Angmar
04-25-2008, 03:38 PM
Yeah that would work well especially with dragons.

LordSlayer
04-25-2008, 03:40 PM
Yeah that would work well especially with dragons.

Yea it would definetly be fun to be able to burn forests, even if it's just to deny your ennemy a ressource.

Neotyguy40
04-25-2008, 03:51 PM
Yea it would definetly be fun to be able to burn forests, even if it's just to deny your ennemy a ressource.

Might as well burn their city as well...

LordSlayer
04-25-2008, 03:52 PM
Might as well burn their city as well...

Unless you bealive mayan myths, stone is usually not flammable :cool:

Neotyguy40
04-25-2008, 03:59 PM
Unless you bealive mayan myths, stone is usually not flammable :cool:

Yes, but the people in it are :D :eek:

LordSlayer
04-25-2008, 04:04 PM
Yes, but the people in it are :D :eek:

I hope they would have left before the building started to really burn like hell.

LordSlayer
04-25-2008, 04:05 PM
Yes, but the people in it are :D :eek:

I hope they would have left before the bulding started burning like hell and they started dying from smoke inhalation.

Neotyguy40
04-25-2008, 04:06 PM
I hope they would have left before the bulding started burning like hell and they started dying from smoke inhalation.

Umm, you double posted...

LordSlayer
04-25-2008, 04:07 PM
Umm, you double posted...

They said that my post didn't work, and it appears!! Damm it!!!!

Neotyguy40
04-25-2008, 04:08 PM
They said that my post didn't, and it appears!! Damm it!!!!

Hey hey hey! No swearing!

Puppeteer
04-25-2008, 04:28 PM
Lol just send a cow to knock over a lantern and forest fire's a flaming!
Wonder when the screenshots will actually come...

Neotyguy40
04-25-2008, 04:56 PM
Lol just send a cow to knock over a lantern and forest fire's a flaming!
Wonder when the screenshots will actually come...

Don't expect reverie to post anytime soon...

The Witch King of Angmar
04-25-2008, 05:51 PM
Hopefully they're working on the game and are too busy to post.

Neotyguy40
04-25-2008, 06:17 PM
Hopefully they're working on the game and are too busy to post.

I bet they are working overtime because they're behind schedule... again...

Deja vu...

LordSlayer
04-26-2008, 07:08 AM
I bet they are working overtime because they're behind schedule... again...

Deja vu...

As long as they're improving the game, then that's ok.

Diggz
04-26-2008, 01:47 PM
Ok...

Men of the alpine regions here I come, I can't help turtling and if i try to go offensive I get rolled. :(

But wheres magic? I read on gamespot that theres magic.. I wanna blow you all to hell!!! :eek: :eek: :eek:

The Witch King of Angmar
04-26-2008, 04:16 PM
There is magic, they just haven't released alot about it yet.

LordSlayer
04-27-2008, 07:18 AM
But wheres magic? I read on gamespot that theres magic.. I wanna blow you all to hell!!! :eek: :eek: :eek:

They don't want to show it to us so when we get the game and get our whole army blasted to oblivion by a lone spellcaster we understand the power of magic.

Puppeteer
04-27-2008, 10:33 AM
Oh, we were told of the system of magic a while ago. You're going to have to dig that up from a dead topic and read it (no pun intended). One aspect was, say you cast the Light-side spell for Fire called "Warmth" or something similar, which provides like a leadership boost to your troops, an offensive water spell on them would be 300% more damaging. Stuff like that.