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View Full Version : Dont Make The Same Accident


SPARROW94
05-28-2007, 10:42 AM
i just fnised looking at in game pictures and i noticed a troll that towerd over the rest of the infantry. and in BFME2 the attack troll was easy to take down and you SHOULD make the big troll become the nightmare of death. i always love a challeng in RTS games in just makes the game more kewl:D

Ndition
05-28-2007, 03:09 PM
i just fnised looking at in game pictures and i noticed a troll that towerd over the rest of the infantry. and in BFME2 the attack troll was easy to take down and you SHOULD make the big troll become the nightmare of death. i always love a challeng in RTS games in just makes the game more kewl:D

shouldn't this be in the suggestion thread? :eek:

anyway I agree with you there, there's nothing worse when the huge units are killed off easy.

SPARROW94
05-28-2007, 03:20 PM
i thinks its the best idea ever just one big troll taking out a number of battelions then taking it down would be like getting an achvement :)

and your right this should be an game suggestion

Ndition
05-28-2007, 03:32 PM
i thinks its the best idea ever just one big troll taking out a number of battelions then taking it down would be like getting an achvement :)

and your right this should be an game suggestion

It's a good idea yes, but the troll should have some negative parts too like a resource eater and should be very very expensive, otherwise we'll see a bunch of lame troll-kiddies that has like 20 trolls :P

SPARROW94
05-28-2007, 03:34 PM
yeah man, thats a great idea or it could be like a hero

SPARROW94
05-28-2007, 03:55 PM
oh and i noticed in the video theres a ent bigger then the troll we were talking about likes its huge

Darvin
06-04-2007, 12:06 PM
Attack Trolls in BFME2 were fricken annoying because it was easy to coax them to run into pikes and impale themselves, and basically required their player to baby-sit them. The most important thing is to make sure the AI is slightly more intelligent and doesn't do stupid things. It's one thing to need to micromanage to optimize your army's performance, it's another thing to have to micromanage because units walk into certain doom by default >_<

Konstantin Fomenko
06-05-2007, 08:35 AM
I promiss Orcs, and especially walking trees (Ents is a copyrighted term) will be hard to take down. Battle for the Middle Earth - Part 1 style.

Joseph Visscher
06-06-2007, 10:59 AM
I like the idea, i think that the trolls should have AI to avoid pikes and run after normal swordmen and archers if they are away from the pikes.
and again the battle trees and trolls should hate fire and majic and be afraid of them, and light up the tree if it catches on fire :P

Solomai
06-07-2007, 02:31 AM
Just a thought, aren't trolls supposed to be a bit thick?

I always thought of trolls as the schoolyard bullies, big, tough, short tempered and too stupid for their own good, in that sense I would've thought that goading them into reckless behaviour would be quite realistic :)

Ryan Zelazny
06-07-2007, 02:29 PM
Just a thought, aren't trolls supposed to be a bit thick?

I always thought of trolls as the schoolyard bullies, big, tough, short tempered and too stupid for their own good, in that sense I would've thought that goading them into reckless behaviour would be quite realistic :)

I quite agree with your point, Solomai. Having differing levels of AI based on the actual intelligence of the creature is very good for keeping the theme with a game, especially where such things as trolls do exist. Is it good for gameplay? Well from what we've heard it's a no, so far. These types of things will be based on how things work out once they are implimented, and we find out what works best, both from our own standpoints and the standpoints of the beta testers.

Darvin
06-07-2007, 02:34 PM
Gameplay value should trump realism (otherwise the bases should be at least a few hours of walking from each other, now shouldn't they?), and the added management of having to baby-sit your trolls (or cavalry, for that matter) is certainly something that isn't desireable. I don't think making them chase after the most vulnerable units is absolutely necessary, just make it so that they won't run towards the ones they're vulnerabe to.

I've got a lot of experience with BFME2 as I worked with a group that made an extensive mod to rework the game mechanics. Attack trolls were one of the most annoying to work with since their primary counter was actually an AI bug that we couldn't fix.

The Witch King of Angmar
06-07-2007, 04:44 PM
Gameplay value should trump realism (otherwise the bases should be at least a few hours of walking from each other, now shouldn't they?), and the added management of having to baby-sit your trolls (or cavalry, for that matter) is certainly something that isn't desireable. I don't think making them chase after the most vulnerable units is absolutely necessary, just make it so that they won't run towards the ones they're vulnerabe to.


Yeah along with realism I think that is a bit over the edge yet it still needs to be realistic. This goes along with the troll thing but, what if say 15 archers shot at a troll and since its hide is so thick the arrows would stick out of him like in the scene of LOTR ROTK where the Mumakil got all shot in the legs.

SPARROW94
06-07-2007, 06:57 PM
yeah better point

Solomai
06-10-2007, 05:14 AM
I quite agree with your point, Solomai. Having differing levels of AI based on the actual intelligence of the creature is very good for keeping the theme with a game, especially where such things as trolls do exist. Is it good for gameplay? Well from what we've heard it's a no, so far. These types of things will be based on how things work out once they are implimented, and we find out what works best, both from our own standpoints and the standpoints of the beta testers.

Gameplay value should trump realism (otherwise the bases should be at least a few hours of walking from each other, now shouldn't they?), and the added management of having to baby-sit your trolls (or cavalry, for that matter) is certainly something that isn't desireable. I don't think making them chase after the most vulnerable units is absolutely necessary, just make it so that they won't run towards the ones they're vulnerabe to.

I've got a lot of experience with BFME2 as I worked with a group that made an extensive mod to rework the game mechanics. Attack trolls were one of the most annoying to work with since their primary counter was actually an AI bug that we couldn't fix.


I totally agree with both of you on the gameplay vs realism point, I was merely making an observation...

Obviously from a balance perspective trolls would be a very powerful unit and to have an easily exploited weakness would render them virtually useless... at the same time perhaps a good balance could be a percentage chance that trolls will berserk after they take so much damage, reducing their defense value but increasing their attack, and when they hit say 10% health make a reckless charge or something? that would make them behave in a more troll-like manner whilst maintaining playability

The problem with trolls is that a few arrows would only **** them off

It would totally suck if it took like 200 archers and a full heavy cavalry company to bring 1 down :p talk about realistic :rolleyes: lol

Darvin
06-10-2007, 06:33 PM
I'm generally not a fan of randomness in these kinds of games. I've said this before, and I'll say it again for this forum: if the randomness is noticeable, it's unfair; if the randomness is not noticeable, it's pointless.

In any event, the sample size of the random events (be it inaccuracies in attacks or units going berserk) should be significantly large enough in order that they can be expected to stay close to their average value. This is important so that games aren't decided by a lucky streak. If I flip a coin only three times, there's a distinct chance I could flip heads every time. If I flip a coin three hundred times, that's not a concern.

JurassicPork
01-21-2011, 07:01 AM
Balancing trolls etcwould be extremely difficult but I like the idea of having 'Super' units. Perhaps a build limit on these units would make it a fairer playing field. It would be great to see one of the units enter the battlefiled and think 'oh crap'. Surely having to quickly change tactics and formations to deal with a new threat is what RTS is about? The satisfaction of shifting forces to deal with such a threat and being successful is very rewarding as is unleashing such a unit on an opponents weakest flank and decimating them quickly. Mwuhaahaaha

Fenix
01-21-2011, 07:30 AM
I like the idea of troll, but I think too that have very much optimized the ia