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Alex Walz
03-12-2010, 03:36 PM
FANTASY FRIDAY XVII
The Homelands of Teria

Welcome back to another Fantasy Friday! Seeing as how there have been a couple questions regarding how MMORTS Homelands work, I thought it would be best to address these curiosities with today's showcase. We will be looking into the three human homelands: Southmont, the Rollingplain, and the Wold.

Dawn of Fantasy's MMORTS, or Online Kingdom, mode gameplay revolves around a player's Homeland territory, which can be built in one of nine regions across the game world of Mythador. Players will develop their homeland from a single building (a couple in the case of the orcs), worker units, and a hero unit to a massive empire complete with layers of heavy walls and keeps, a complex economy, and a number of armies and trade caravans wandering the map. To develop this city, players can gather resources, construct various buildings, recruit new units, and research powerful upgrades and new abilities. Even when a player is offline, their homeland will still be in development with the worker units still gathering resources and finishing constructing any buildings tasked shortly before logging off. Although, the gathering, construction, and training rates are significantly slower than in the fast-paced Skirmish modes.

At your homeland, you will meet an Advisor unit, who will give you your first quests, which will ease the MMORTS learning curve in their introduction to many of the game's mechanics. These quests form the foundation of the MMORTS Campaign storyline and unlock various elements of the game, through which you will discover the large world of Dawn of Fantasy, with its myriad of characters, events, and subplots. While most of these quests engage the player in PvE gameplay throughout the twelve major NPC strongholds of Mythador, there are a couple PvP quests in which players must conquer similarly-matched players in a specified region. Completion of these quests typically results in additional resources or units.

If at any point your own homeland is threatened, you will be able to opt out of the battle by paying a tribute to your attacker. If you decline this payment and ultimately lose the battle at hand, your loss will not be devastating. Your homeland will recover but suffer a small loss of some units, resources, and buildings while the victor will receive a considerable amount of resources.

The text below is specific to the individual homeland, while the screenshots and captions contain information relevant to each of the human homelands.

http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/southmontcreationthumb.jpg (http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/southmontcreation.jpg)
<font size="-2">Begin your adventure by choosing your homeland at the New Stronghold page. Browse through the nine regions before making your choice.</font>

The Alpine Region of Southmont

Seen by many as the capital of Teria, Southmont is home to the important cities of Dagbor and Raebor. <table align="right" border="0" width="240"><tr><td><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/southmontearly.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/southmontearlythumb.jpg" width="200"></a><br><font size="-2">A Southmount stronghold in its earliest stages. Look closely for a first glimpse of our new building GUI and unit formations. Your homeland will start off with two battalions of peasants, two battalions of swordsmen, a hero, three building plots, and a Town Hall - in which you can train peasants and horse carts and purchase a layer of walls, houses, or additional building plots.</font></td></tr></table>Dagbor itself lies on a flat plain ringed by mountains, but far more typically, cities in this region are built in the mountains themeslves, taking advantage of the Alpine terrain to provide natural defenses.

The bitter rivalry between Dagbor and Menthorn arises in part because strongholds built in the rugged hills of Southmont are quite powerful and difficult to dislodge. This in turn has led to Dagbor dominating all of Teria.

<table align="left" border="0" width="240"><tr><td><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/southmonttraits.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/southmonttraitsthumb.jpg" width="200"></a><br><font size="-2">After choosing a race and a homeland, pick out a Primary and a Secondary Trait for an instant bonus in the respective field.</font></td></tr></table>During the War of the Lost Kings, Menthorns and their allies savaged great swaths of Southmont. To spur economic revival, King Erian has now opened up many lordships in this region, encouraging knights to come and rebuild the devastated land.

Southmont players have by far the best strongholds. An abundance of stone mines allows top-notch fortifications to be built and fully upgraded. By raising large herds of sheep, and by exploiting their numerous gold mines, players are able to turtle-up, quest, research, and prosper.

Economic Bonus:
-Mountain-dwelling sheep flourish here, with a fattening generation rate increase of +50%.

Economic Penalty:
-Other domesticated animals, however, are less suited to rugged Southmont, so pig and cow fattening generation rates receive a -25% penalty.

Research Adjustments:
-The difficult life in alpine villages has bred a resourceful and innovative people. Consequently, all upgrades and research in Southmont are at a -25% cost.

Building Price Adjustment:
-Weapon production in Southmont is more difficult than it is in the flatlands, <table align="right" border="0" width="240"><tr><td><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/southmont1.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/southmont1thumb.jpg" width="200"></a><br><font size="-2">Can you build an empire out of a Town Hall and a couple peasants and swordsmen?</font></td></tr></table>and building a Blacksmith requires +200% wood.

Unit Price Adjustments:
-A long associations with the Royal Court at Dagbor, and the advanced training of the Royal Army, benefits all who recruit knights in this region. Both Melee Knights and Mounted Knights receive a -25% gold and food cost benefit.

Military Bonus:
-The advanced military skills of the Royal Army also benefits all Melee Units who are trained in Southmont, and they receive a +25% Armor benefit, except for Pierce Armor, as the subtler aspects of ranged weaponry still elude them.

Stronghold Adjustments:
-Strongholds are easily laid out so that the cliffs surround half of the stronghold perimeter. A huge bridge with a mountain river flowing under it is always available to serve as one of the entrances.


<table width="900" border="0"><tr><td width="300"><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/southmontquest.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/southmontquestthumb.jpg"></a><br><font size="-2">At your new homeland, you will be met by an Advisor unit who will give you your first quests and introduce you to MMORTS gameplay.</font></center></td><td width="300"><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/southmontstone.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/southmontstonethumb.jpg"></a><br><font size="-2">My peasants began mining from a rare, unguarded stone mine but were quickly ambushed with rogue troops, forcing me to call in my swordsmen.</font></center></td><td width="300"><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/southmontgeo.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/southmontgeothumb.jpg"></a><br><font size="-2">The geography of Southmont is characterized by rugged terrain, mountain streams, and waterfalls.</font></center></td></tr></table>


http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/rollingmenuthumb.jpg (http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/rollingmenu.jpg)
<font size="-2">A typical Rollingplain stronghold represents the region when you pick out your homeland.</font>

The Plains Region of the Rollingplain

Rollingplain is one of the older provinces of Teria. Thorndale stronghold dominates this flat, meadow-rich, wide-open landscape. Traditionally, the Lords of Thorndale have considered themselves loyal vassals to the King of Dagbor, and this in turn has placed the men of Rollingplain at odds with the rebellious <table align="left" border="0" width="240"><tr><td><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/rollingstart.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/rollingstartthumb.jpg" width="200"></a><br><font size="-2">Humble Beginnings</font></td></tr></table>Menthorns. For its part, Dagbor has always recognized the strategic value of Rollingplain, as it serves as a buffer between Southmont, the Realm of the Elves, and the great open borders of the Orcish Realm in the east. During the War of the Lost Kings, the orcs destroyed many lordships in Rollingplain. As a result, in the ruinous aftermath, there is plenty of empty land up for grab. Dagbor would prefer to see this area settled by knights loyal to the King, but dislocated and disaffected rebels from Menthorn are equally likely to settle here.

In Rollingplain, players will have to rely on a gold-based economy. Cavalry and infantry will be the backbone of their army. Lack of ranged units will create some difficulty with sieges, but Rollingplain riders will top any cavalry of the world. In the wide open plains, trees are scarce, so strongholds will tend to be built from stone, making a dramatic silhouette on the horizon line. In this wide-open, thinly forested region, which is half alpine terrain, players will find plenty of room for building and expanding their city. <table align="right" border="0" width="240"><tr><td><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/rollingattack.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/rollingattackthumb.jpg" width="200"></a><br><font size="-2">My stronghold after fending off its first attack, some rogue swordsmen - not including the wolf pack who picked off some of my peasants earlier. Wolves are an early threat in the human homelands as they will charge your camp with surprising speed and prey on nearby deer, which are valuable to an early economy.</td></tr></table>Gold mines are plentiful and will drive the economy effectively. Stone will be the building material of choice, as stone mines here are easy to find. Hunting is available, but there are limited herds of deer.

Economic Bonus:
-Gold will provide the economic power for any Rollingplain lordship, with a mining output of +25%.

Economic Penalty:
-Reduced forests and a wood gathering rate of -25% will limit the usefullness of this resource in Rollingplain. The thin, dry grasslands are not optimal for raising herds, either. Cow, sheep, and pig fattening and generation rates are reduced by 25%. And the thin soil reduces farming production rates by 25%.

Research Adjustments:
-In the thin grassland ecosystem, economies mature slowly. This results in a +25% additional cost to all economic <table align="left" border="0" width="240"><tr><td><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/rollinggold.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/rollinggoldthumb.jpg" width="200"></a><br><font size="-2">While gold may be plentiful in the Rollingplain, don't expect it to be unguarded. Even a lone Ogre can prevent you from mining gold without several battalions of infantry or some ranged units at your disposal.</font></td></tr></table>upgrades.
-The wide open plains are also unfriendly to soldiers who specialize in ranged weapons, and they too suffer a +25% cost to their upgrades.
-Cavalry and infantry will flourish here, however, and they get a reduction of -25% cost to all upgrades.

Building Price Adjustments:
-Local ingenuity over the centuries in Rollingplain means the people <table align="right" border="0" width="240"><tr><td><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/rollingquest.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/rollingquestthumb.jpg" width="200"></a><br><font size="-2">Bring your wounded troops to the Healing Well located next to your Town Hall to recover lost hitpoints.</font></td></tr></table>here build with alternative materials and consequently use less lumber, so houses require -25% wood.
-Farms, on the other hand, require additional outlays in order to make the soil arable and adequately irrigated. This adds +200% gold to the cost of plowing new fields.

Unit Price Adjustments:
-As mentioned early, Cavalry, Swordsmen, and Macemen flourish in the broad fields of Rollingplain, and they require -25% food and gold.
-Ranged units, however, fair poorly in the wide-open terrain. Trebuchets and Archers both incur a +25% wood penalty when they are recruited.

Military Bonus:
-Cavalry is definitely master of the battlefield in these broad meadows, and they receive a movement bonus of +25%.


<table width="900" border="0"><tr><td width="300"><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/rollingfarm1.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/rollingfarm1thumb.jpg"></a><br><font size="-2">In the nearby meadows, there are a couple building plots that are yours for the taking - if you can fight off any nearby rogues, that is. Unlike the plots within your walls, these plots can only support Farms.</font></center></td><td width="300"><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/rollingfarm2.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/rollingfarm2thumb.jpg"></a><br><font size="-2">While waiting for my Farm to be completed, my peasants loot the corpses of those rogues unfortunate enough to make a camp nearby.</font></center></td><td width="300"><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/rollingfarm3.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/rollingfarm3thumb.jpg"></a><br><font size="-2">My peasants plant and harvest the wheat fields surrounding my new Farm.</font></center></td></tr></table>


http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/woldmapthumb.jpg (http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/woldmap.jpg)
<font size="-2">The Wold as seen from the World Map. While normally a lush, grassland region, we'll be visiting it in the winter for a change of scenery. My homeland, creatively named "Homeland," can be seen in the northeast of the region.</font>

The Grassland Region of the Wold

According to <table align="left" border="0" width="240"><tr><td><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/woldstart.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/woldstartthumb.jpg" width="200"></a><br><font size="-2">Just moved in! The area in black surrounding my Town Hall has yet to be explored.</font></td></tr></table>ancient Terian lore, the first human settlements were built in the Wold, and Menthorn was the first great stronghold to arise in the Older Times. In later years, however, the Dagborians of Southmont became the pre-eminent lords of Teria. To this day, the Menthorns believe that their rightful place as the leading Lords of Teria has been usurped from them. Thus, when times are uncertain, the Menthorns seize the opportunity to strike out against Dagbor.

After the War of the Lost Kings, however, the Menthorns were scattered and their power was broken. Now the lands of the Wold have been opened up by the King of Dagbor to knights who want to make a fresh start there.

In the Wold, players will be able to build a strong economy by harvesting wood. Here, under the protective cover of the ancient coastal forest, ranged units develop quickly, receiving significant combat bonuses. <table align="right" border="0" width="240"><tr><td><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/woldquest.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/woldquestthumb.jpg" width="200"></a><br><font size="-2">Save the Ale! A homeland quest worthy of my best soldiers. "And I did hear a report of an extremely intoxicated orc who was sighted -- pretending to be a cow! So I fear the worst!"</font></td></tr></table>And the Wold player is the best in Teria when it comes to offensive siege warfare. On the defensive side of the equation, mighty Wold Archers and Harlberdiers make a deadly combination.

Economic Bonus:
-The thick plentiful forests provide a Wood Gathering rate increase of +25%. However, the land is not very well suited to domesticated animals. As a result, cow, sheep, and pig fattening and generation rates are reduced by -25%.
-This is counterbalanced by the rich, mulch-fed soil that has built up over the generations beneath the deciduous canopy, where the Farm Gathering rate is +25%. Ample herds of wild deer yield a Hunting Rate of +25%.

Economic Penalty:
-The economy of the Wold player will be driven by timber harvesting, especially since both gold and stone are scarce here, with Mining Rates of -25%. A lack of stone will slow down <table align="left" border="0" width="240"><tr><td><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/woldherodead.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/woldherodeadthumb.jpg" width="200"></a><br><font size="-2">If you hero dies in battle, you can revive him at your Town Hall.</font></td></tr></table>castle building.

Research Adjustments:
-The native resourcefulness of forest-dwelling people will make innovation easier to accomplish in the Wold. All economic upgrades receive a -25% cost benefit. Ranged units also thrive here and their upgrades cost -25%.
-The Wold, however, is not hospitable to cavalry or heavy infantry units, and upgrading them requires a +25% cost.

Building Price Adjustments:
-Ironically, the ample supply of wood has led citizens of the Wold to expect more outlay in the construction of their Houses, which require +25% wood.

Unit Price Adjustments:
-Since ranged units prosper in the protective canopy of the ancient forest, Archers, Trebuchets, and Siege Weapons requre 25% less wood, with Archers requiring an additional 25% less food.
-The one infantry unit that can easily be trained in the Wold is the Halberdier, with pikes that can be readily constructed from the ample timber supplies. As a result, they require -25% wood and -25% food.
-Cavalry are costly to train and maintain in the forest, however, and require +25% gold.

Military Bonus:
-The opportunity for bowmen to practice with their ranged weapons in the forest has led to a greater skill in this area, and all ranged units from the Wold receive +25% range.
-Superior knowledge of the damage inflicted by arrows has led to the development of +25% Pierce Armor for all Melee Units trained here.


<table width="900" border="0"><tr><td width="300"><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/woldwell.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/woldwellthumb.jpg"></a><br><font size="-2">A stronghold under construction.</font></center></td><td width="300"><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/woldsummer.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/woldsummerthumb.jpg"></a><br><font size="-2">The grassland region in the summer season.</font></center></td><td width="300"><center><a href="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/woldmidgame.jpg"><img src="http://reverieworld.com/screenshots/ff17/woldmidgamethumb.jpg"></a><br><font size="-2">As the winter season draws to an end, my stronghold stands tall with a layer of heavy walls in the works and the backbone of a future army.</font></center></td></tr></table>

Henry Martin
03-12-2010, 03:45 PM
Nice, great to hear you get bonus and penalties for where you decide to set up you empire, which adds to the strategy of playing the game. I also like the choice you get to start.

welshie
03-12-2010, 03:45 PM
Nice already decided where im to lay my stronghold, Wold :) Kepp up the good work devs i cnt wait for next fridays version :)

sneaky_squirrel
03-12-2010, 03:48 PM
Can't wait to decide which region I'll start out in :D.

Generation
03-12-2010, 03:54 PM
Shiny I like shiny :D nice pictures like how the details are done

Alex Walz
03-12-2010, 03:54 PM
Still adding screenshots - there's a lot for this one. :) So if you've already checked it out, please check it again in half an hour for new screens.

metman
03-12-2010, 03:56 PM
This is great. I've already decided where I am going to put my stronghold as well, Wold.

GPS51
03-12-2010, 04:24 PM
I love it. I can't wait to play the beta. Seriously keep these FF's coming. Any chance of getting to make a FF and Fantasy tuesday? I love how each region makes a distinct choice of gameplay but not to an imbalance. Great job. It's looking more and more epic. I'm spreading the word since I'm waiting for it to come out! BTW do the advisors resemble any RWS personnel?

Zeluk
03-12-2010, 04:27 PM
Humans are nice, Elves next please :D.

Alex Walz
03-12-2010, 04:48 PM
Any chance of getting to make a FF and Fantasy tuesday?
Today's 22 screenshots aren't enough to last you until next Friday? :p

BTW do the advisors resemble any RWS personnel?
Well there is this one crazy Russian elf living in a shack in the mountains who fires arrows at you if you step on his territory. A bunch of us at the office nicknamed him Kon. ;)

GPS51
03-12-2010, 05:00 PM
Wow. Did you just add the print under each screenie? That's terrific and way more informative then my primitive guesses. :)

The_Biz
03-12-2010, 05:02 PM
sweet

glad to see a nice economic emphasis.

Justin
03-12-2010, 05:06 PM
After looking at this i would have to go with southmont as my location if I am humans but I have not yet decided on a race.

Darathor
03-12-2010, 05:23 PM
I just love how you presented this awesome and very informative screenshot display! I'm glad that you guys are even making the same race differ from region to region. This looks really detailed and awesome. :D

I was really tempted to pick the fourth option,:D but I know that I'll have to try out humans at some point.:

Swift sword
03-12-2010, 05:54 PM
Definitely Southmont. Great Fantasy Friday, by the way, best in awhile if you ask me. Tons of info. I think Rollingplais may be underpowered unless gold is more important than other resources. I think Wold is fairly on par with Southmont-I was tempted to go with it.

Alex Walz
03-12-2010, 06:07 PM
I actually thought Rollingplain would get a lot of votes. I guess might be because we haven't talked much about cavalry yet. But it's a big advantage for the region - kind of like Dawn of Fantasy's Rohan

Swift sword
03-12-2010, 06:12 PM
So, cavalry are sort of like an elite unit that is expensive but extremely devestating if used correctly?
I sorta guessed that's how it'd be, but I wasn't sure. Also, cavalry wouldn't be exactly useful in siege due to a lack of ability to reach defenders until the gate is bashed down, which decreases usefulness slightly.

GPS51
03-12-2010, 06:15 PM
Right but can't cavalry be used if you find a secret door into the castle? I KNOW ITS ANTI RL. Twould be a great idea. I would point out we fans haven't seen a cav unit in any of the showcases yet. But I'm more of a large ax/mace person myself.

Swift sword
03-12-2010, 06:44 PM
I suppose. I didn't think there were secret doors. Make's it a bit too easy, don't you think?

By the way, a thought just struck me-how long does it typically take to train a battalion of swordsmen? Kind of intrigued to see how long it'll take to build up a decent force.

GPS51
03-12-2010, 07:05 PM
Well don't they have sally ports for the defender? I assumed as the attacker you could turn them around.

Kire
03-12-2010, 07:16 PM
I picked alpine region tho i live more in higher land and it also provides more defense since i like that. Beside, archers from wold looks tempting but huh i guess they are just bad version of imba elf ones =P and grassland in spring/summer must look very nice.
This was the best showcase ever for me (not picture wise but info wise =)). As ppl said i also like very much the diversity of the lands not just in looks but also from other aspects.
It would be also nice if each region would have some distinctive looks on units or buildings (aka more woodish or stoneish and some ornaments and maybe also some special armor or weaponry).

Swift sword
03-12-2010, 07:52 PM
Hmm, I'm slightly afraid that most players will choose the Southmont region, putting a certain similiarty in play styles and cities. On the other hand, the players of the game who've actually seen this and not a cavalry post (later on) that expands upon it's bonuses will be in the minority. After all, I'm only choosing Southmont because I live in a pretty flat area, and as such am always amazed if I ever visit a mountanous region. It strikes me as nice to think that I'll be able to see that sort of scenery every day if I make my city there.

Also, my rts play style is fairly turtilish. It's probably because I fail at multi-tasking, and need walls to protect everything for me :p .

In regards to GPS, I'd hope we wouldn't be able to use Postern gates as a way in. Not only is it un-realistic (people don't design open doors into fortresses) it'd be unbalancing because people could bypass both wall and gates easily, even if they are hard to find. My final argument against it is that they've never shown an AI/themselve taking advantage of them. Unless it's going to be this game's best-kept secret strategically, I don't see it being implemented.

zach12wqasxz
03-12-2010, 11:19 PM
Hmm, I'm slightly afraid that most players will choose the Southmont region, putting a certain similiarty in play styles and cities. On the other hand, the players of the game who've actually seen this and not a cavalry post (later on) that expands upon it's bonuses will be in the minority. After all, I'm only choosing Southmont because I live in a pretty flat area, and as such am always amazed if I ever visit a mountanous region. It strikes me as nice to think that I'll be able to see that sort of scenery every day if I make my city there.

Also, my rts play style is fairly turtilish. It's probably because I fail at multi-tasking, and need walls to protect everything for me :p .

In regards to GPS, I'd hope we wouldn't be able to use Postern gates as a way in. Not only is it un-realistic (people don't design open doors into fortresses) it'd be unbalancing because people could bypass both wall and gates easily, even if they are hard to find. My final argument against it is that they've never shown an AI/themselve taking advantage of them. Unless it's going to be this game's best-kept secret strategically, I don't see it being implemented.


ya it seems like everyone will be going into the mountains to setup up there stronghold. i also was going to, but if theres gonna be calvary bonuses in the plains im definalty switching to there, calvary own everything except spearmen, so the enemy will have little to defend agianst my epic LOTR style calvary charged

GPS51
03-13-2010, 12:09 AM
Epic charge ....meet epic berserkers :)

welshie
03-13-2010, 12:41 AM
Just to clarify the only 'Secret doors' are used for defenders and probably easily brought down/blockaded if the enemy tryed to gain access. And im an minority \o/, to me southmont region was inferior to the other 2, as although i like to turtle. I think the wold would be an easy start and harder end game and southmont would be hard start and easier end game.

blackfang
03-13-2010, 02:08 AM
i like it, the world that is. It looks awesome

nickson104
03-13-2010, 03:37 AM
I love how all the regions will offer different styles of playing... I am not sure which I would use... Cavalry are awesome... But so are archers... But then again a mountain stronghold is also awesome... :eek: :D

Puppeteer
03-13-2010, 04:27 AM
I actually thought Rollingplain would get a lot of votes. I guess might be because we haven't talked much about cavalry yet. But it's a big advantage for the region - kind of like Dawn of Fantasy's Rohan

Well, that may be because it looks as if they get the most numerous disadvantages - well, that's how it appeared when I read the showcase. But then again, cavalry are amazing. In any case, I think we've established that all the regions are awesome :cool:
Oh keep using tables for your showcases, it's great presentation!

wills370
03-13-2010, 05:20 AM
I like the showcase. I think more dynamic players willl choose the flats while i myself would probably go for the mountian region for its greater flow of ready gold,food (gold makes the world go round:P). and with dagbor close etc i can probably trade more readily to with acess to more merc's and trade routes.

So guess its the mountians for me :P

Justin
03-13-2010, 08:39 AM
The planes seem to have the most disadvantages, and the military bonus is just a speed upgrade not an attack or defense, it does not look good on paper but it may be more balanced in game.

Aametherar
03-13-2010, 09:39 AM
Looks to me like options are:

Turtle, with very few minuses (probably why so many picked them) but also no extreme bonuses short of their defensive terrain. I figure a lot picked this one since those planning to go humans were already in the mindset of being a turtle.

Then:

Devastating cavalry and fast moving armies for aggressive tactical players with a lot of minuses, but the positive being potentially massive to the tactical player.

and last but not least:

A mix of turtle/aggressor a slower moving army with the ability to defend itself from heavy cavalry armies with the right tactics. Also having the ability to move in for a heavy siege, and has the archers to defend it's own battlements.

All in all a very nice looking mix, personally i'd go for the cavalry, I don't see many armies doing too well against extra fast moving cavalry harassing them constantly (of course I picked the bottom one anyways, goo Orc!). This was an amazing FF, I am dying to see Orc homelands now!

Henry Martin
03-13-2010, 10:11 AM
Looks to me like options are:

Turtle, with very few minuses (probably why so many picked them) but also no extreme bonuses short of their defensive terrain. I figure a lot picked this one since those planning to go humans were already in the mindset of being a turtle.

Then:

Devastating cavalry and fast moving armies for aggressive tactical players with a lot of minuses, but the positive being potentially massive to the tactical player.

and last but not least:

A mix of turtle/aggressor a slower moving army with the ability to defend itself from heavy cavalry armies with the right tactics. Also having the ability to move in for a heavy siege, and has the archers to defend it's own battlements.

All in all a very nice looking mix, personally i'd go for the cavalry, I don't see many armies doing too well against extra fast moving cavalry harassing them constantly (of course I picked the bottom one anyways, goo Orc!). This was an amazing FF, I am dying to see Orc homelands now!

Yeah Thats why I choose Wold, as I am a mix defense and offense. The wold players seem like the ones to attack the southmount players with their heavy siege equipment and good archers.

I agree, I want to see the orcs and elves homeland.

blackfang
03-13-2010, 10:13 AM
I am a über fan of pikies thus the world was the obvious choice:o

Swift sword
03-13-2010, 10:24 AM
Yeah-the extra negatives of the plains region makes it look bad on paper, but cavalry could very well be a pivotal aspect of combat. A good cavalry charge could turn the tide of a battle tettering on the edge of a cliff.

I do like the Wold region as well though, which makes me think that if I make a second human city, I'll make it in the Wold region to try it out.

To be honest, I think movement speed is more important for cavalry than stats. Cavalry are meant to be a hit-and-run type unit for the most part-in hand to hand, an enemy could get pikemen in to close for comfort, and calvary lose their prolific trample ability up close and personal.

Darathor
03-13-2010, 10:52 AM
On paper, Rollingplain doesn't look quite as good as the others because it has so many detractors. I suspect that the better cavalry will amount to much more than we think right now and will dominate the battlefield when used correctly. Rollingplain is also on the frontier against the elves, that's also why everyone is too scared to build their city there.:D

Konstantin Fomenko
03-13-2010, 10:58 AM
Looks like we`ll need boost Rollingplain a bit.
We are making them best wheat farmers, as well as superior to Southmount with gold mining and deposits. Now Rollingplain players will be able to feed the rest of Teria, and use the gold to buy anything they like from other provinces.

Personally Rollingplain is my favorite atm. I love controlling large cavalry forces, mixed with heavy infantry (also Rollginplain`s strong points) And Rollingplain is right next to both Elven, Orcish and Dragon realms - so I can raid any race I like, and withdraw my armies back to the safety quickly. I did miss having large ranged armies (I chopped most of "few" trees in my homeland in the first day and they are bloody slow to grow back) - but long distance trading is an easy remedy for this. Mine gold, and buy all the archers and trebuchets you want at Thorndale, Wold region. IF you want huge walls - could be done as well - mass wheat farm, collect food, sell food at Dagbor during winter (they pay the most I think 1.7 gold during summer, and 2.5 during winter) - and bring back caravans loaded with stone.

Konstantin Fomenko
03-13-2010, 11:00 AM
And to address the problem of overpopulation - if too many players will flood south-mount, we`ll start offering gold and free-units incentives for players settling in less-populated regions.

Henry Martin
03-13-2010, 11:14 AM
And to address the problem of overpopulation - if too many players will flood south-mount, we`ll start offering gold and free-units incentives for players settling in less-populated regions.

Then maybe I will start in southmount!:D

welshie
03-13-2010, 11:56 AM
Its nice to know about your plans to try and reduce overcrowded areas, Im glad one devolper has saw this problem and started to act. For me i see it more like Wold area bouns'/troops>Rolling plain Bouns'/troops>southmont bonus'/troops> Wold ext ext. They all look so pleasing but for me i want the option for good defence and still be able to go outside and not get obliverated by carverly. I think this is what people have to look at as well, It's all good being a turtle but when you want to go out because your city state is the best at everything i would want to go out and destroy someone just for a laugh, but turtling means that your offence will struggle against none turtlers in tactics and in recouses.

Swift sword
03-13-2010, 12:07 PM
^That's an example of the balancing factor between Southmont and Rollingplain. Rollingplain's forts can be attacked successfully from pretty much any direction but their cavalry will help stop a siege before it starts. Wold is definitely balanced, and I think Rollingplain may be more balanced than we think. I do believe that Rollingplain needs a couple specific boosts to something other than food and cavalry, because cavalry aren't exactly the most useful troop type in sieges. Maybe give them better trebuchets or something because they have to build them more efficiently due to a lack of wood.

Right now, I simply can't imagine failing to defend my city against a plains player. Their archer's significant debuffs will definitely hurt them on both the sieging and defending side of things. Then again, we can't really judge. It sounds like the Devs like Rollingplains alot, and they're the only ones who've played it, so if they think it's balanced, I'll be the last to argue. I do like the anti-overcrowding methods that they're planning to use is things get bad, although it looks like a hefty sum of players will choose Wold. As to those who chose the last option- I shan't speak to you! :p

Konstantin Fomenko
03-13-2010, 12:22 PM
One thing for all the turtles to keep in mind - while DoF doesn`t penalize turtling, it doesn`t reward it. You want to be out there - visiting local villages and mercenary camps, fighting various PvE battles, fighting other players, questing and trading - it`s the best way to quickly acquire resources.

Also keep in mind Rollingplain can put our mass sword and shield infantry, that are really efficient against ranged units during castle siege/defense.

Of-course no question about it - Rollingplain players will be better of laying siege in team with another player, who`ll cover the siege equipment. But having large cavalry force, allows pretty good raiding in PvE, on top of that Rollingplain offers plenty of gold - so it`s possible to buy some wood and siege equipment.

We tried to balance it out:)

GPS51
03-13-2010, 12:23 PM
Hmm I'm really impressed with the amount of thought that the devs have put into balancing both city spacing as well as the trading idea for needed resources. Very typical of RL trading. This may break the mold for well balanced and entertaining. I can't remember a game that sounded better as the date approached.

Konstantin Fomenko
03-13-2010, 12:26 PM
Maybe give them better trebuchets or something because they have to build them more efficiently due to a lack of wood.
You do have a point, I guess having to import siege equipment is tad tedious. I think we`ll give a boost to rollingplain rams, perhaps more hp/attack and +60% gold cost, -60% wood cost kinda deal.

Thanks for the feedback guys!

Aametherar
03-13-2010, 12:57 PM
Being an orc player I definitely see the rollingplains players being the largest threat. Not just because the way orc cities are set up, but because I also see the best players being able to use extremely deadly harassment tactics with those mounts (which i guess does go doubly so vs orc cities). I don't see many experienced players even being turtles up in the mountains, so they may even get a visit from me from time to time.

Puppeteer
03-13-2010, 01:09 PM
I'll go for the most picturesque - it's got to be Rolling Plains, with that mill <3
Actually, this game really looks like a medieval Company of Heroes - the starting hall reinforces this, and the neat, precise graphics. Love it!

blackfang
03-13-2010, 03:51 PM
If the pikes are there i can play anything, NEED PIKES!!! However if there are any races without pikes i will never play em... Pikes is a must to EVERY race, so i can't wait the world!!! I will turtle up, make a huge pike based army. Then my slow moving heavily armored army will take down any harassing horsies! Also if archers dare to come near me i will personally make sure that they get the same treatment as suicide bombers get at the point of blast:eek:

Zeluk
03-13-2010, 04:48 PM
personally make sure that they get the same treatment as suicide bombers get at the point of blast:eek:

Hmm bad joke, but good point. Spearmen are needed for balance.
If were to play humans, and that's a big if, I would play Plains humans, Cavalry FTW.

Negthareas
03-13-2010, 05:55 PM
Sorry I haven't been posting for a few days --

I picked Rolling Plains before I even read the FanFry.

1 - I wanted inter-race interaction
2 - I liked the weather

Now that I have read it and the posts, I totally agree with my decision. I think most people perferred Southmount because, being currently unfamilior with the game, most would want to turtle first thing. Then, they will eventually stick their heads out. Advanced players who are willing to take risks will settle in other areas and be ready with an ax once the turtles begin to stick their heads out.

SMACK!!

Rollingplains it is. Go Cavalry. And cheap infantry.

otomotopia
03-13-2010, 06:28 PM
Can't wait to see the orc lands. I see a bonus to speed of Mount spawns, Bonuses to peon/laborer spawns, and unit count bonuses in our future ^^.

Darathor
03-13-2010, 07:34 PM
IF you want huge walls - could be done as well - mass wheat farm, collect food, sell food at Dagbor during winter (they pay the most I think 1.7 gold during summer, and 2.5 during winter) - and bring back caravans loaded with stone.

This trading system looks just so in-depth and amazingly detailed that I just gawk at some of the things you say. This just looks so awesome that I am really really excited for this game.:D

Negthareas
03-13-2010, 07:59 PM
I would say that this is the best Fanfry ever, but I usually say that to every single one, so I won't.

Swift sword
03-13-2010, 08:27 PM
I'm actually starting to change my mind, and I may go with The Wold for my first city. My specialization is definitely going to be defense mastery (or whatever it's called) so I may be more suited to Southmont because of that. I just don't know as of now.

The Witch King of Angmar
03-13-2010, 08:30 PM
Rollingplains because it sounds cool.

Supreme
03-14-2010, 05:23 AM
Inferiors!

wills370
03-14-2010, 05:54 AM
^That's an example of the balancing factor between Southmont and Rollingplain. Rollingplain's forts can be attacked successfully from pretty much any direction but their cavalry will help stop a siege before it starts. Wold is definitely balanced, and I think Rollingplain may be more balanced than we think. I do believe that Rollingplain needs a couple specific boosts to something other than food and cavalry, because cavalry aren't exactly the most useful troop type in sieges. Maybe give them better trebuchets or something because they have to build them more efficiently due to a lack of wood.

Right now, I simply can't imagine failing to defend my city against a plains player. Their archer's significant debuffs will definitely hurt them on both the sieging and defending side of things. Then again, we can't really judge. It sounds like the Devs like Rollingplains alot, and they're the only ones who've played it, so if they think it's balanced, I'll be the last to argue. I do like the anti-overcrowding methods that they're planning to use is things get bad, although it looks like a hefty sum of players will choose Wold. As to those who chose the last option- I shan't speak to you! :p

Pretty much my thoughts also. Although i beleive the extra siege range would be hurtful to the balancing as they are large health units and will be hard enough already to take out. I think a rolling plains player will just focus on destroying a wall and then swarming with calvery and heavy troops. As thoose are where the strengths lie. Could make for a svery powerful combo especially oif you make mulitple breaches and can have your calvery doing loops charging down the streets to avoid any pikemen and harass anything else while the heavy infantry roll on through. I dont see archers posing that much more of a problem. There is also a screen of a horse on the wall? (still applies?) If it does then you could very quickly wqipe out an enemy's entire archers guard on the walls with one squad of horsemen by running them down the parapet. So overall i think the plains could be a very nice offensive set up. And as stated the calvery can harass any aproaching army before it reaches you to the point where it isent worth attackign your castle anyway.

blackfang
03-14-2010, 08:08 AM
Hmm bad joke,

Who ever said it was a joke?

Puppeteer
03-14-2010, 08:53 AM
I would say that this is the best Fanfry ever, but I usually say that to every single one, so I won't.

I think you've hit the nail on the head there :p
I'd go for the Grasslands because of the weather, but for some reason it's snowing at the moment

welshie
03-14-2010, 11:14 AM
Sorry I haven't been posting for a few days --

I picked Rolling Plains before I even read the FanFry.

1 - I wanted inter-race interaction
2 - I liked the weather

Now that I have read it and the posts, I totally agree with my decision. I think most people perferred Southmount because, being currently unfamilior with the game, most would want to turtle first thing. Then, they will eventually stick their heads out. Advanced players who are willing to take risks will settle in other areas and be ready with an ax once the turtles begin to stick their heads out.

SMACK!!

Rollingplains it is. Go Cavalry. And cheap infantry.

I have to agree, players looking at southmont are looking at cutting them selves off from other aspects. Unless ofc you are doing it to deceve people, but i'm choosing wold for archer/pikemen combo as they are most deadly against any mix of troop. whilst keeping archers to defend my castle.

blackfang
03-14-2010, 01:28 PM
I have to agree, players looking at southmont are looking at cutting them selves off from other aspects. Unless ofc you are doing it to deceve people, but i'm choosing wold for archer/pikemen combo as they are most deadly against any mix of troop. whilst keeping archers to defend my castle.

You forgot that pikemen defending inside the walls is the most Über thing you can have. Pikies aiming down the alley and a massive charge coming up. And then we got the remaining archers on the wall pummeling enemies... Thats like a receipt for total annihilation:D

wills370
03-14-2010, 01:49 PM
Hmm true but heavy soldiers that cope well agsint arrows and good agasint pikemen could be the downfall. Espicially if they are heavy attack and can break the formation of the pikemen? Wonder if the pikemen can adapt in shape also or if its TW style where they can only face one way.

welshie
03-14-2010, 01:52 PM
Hmm true but heavy soldiers that cope well agsint arrows and good agasint pikemen could be the downfall. Espicially if they are heavy attack and can break the formation of the pikemen? Wonder if the pikemen can adapt in shape also or if its TW style where they can only face one way.

mmhmm yeh so rolling plain might be issues, might have to wipe them out before they manage to get the troops :)

GPS51
03-14-2010, 02:38 PM
Yeah I would think heavy swordsmen would do nicely vs that combo. With a few fire breathing dragon mercs of course ;)

blackfang
03-14-2010, 02:51 PM
Yeah I would think heavy swordsmen would do nicely vs that combo. With a few fire breathing dragon mercs of course ;)

And then you realize with only heavy armored people left then the axemen come in and take the rest... (basically a army not made out of heavies would loose most of it and then the remaining soldiers of the people defending can attack in their own way...) Heavies are terribly slow and loose a lot of people to fast moving axes so DIE HEAVIES (my combination will definitely take down heavies too...) Also you guys should make heavy pikes! (no need to move the pikes with light armors when you can have them bracing spears at on coming charges:D

GPS51
03-14-2010, 02:56 PM
I LOVE IT! Strategizing and countering has already begun with the beta still a few weeks away. I like the ideas btw

Justin
03-14-2010, 04:07 PM
I LOVE IT! Strategizing and countering has already begun with the beta still a few weeks away. I like the ideas btw Yeah, now all we need to do is actually play the beta to see if any of these strategies actually work

GPS51
03-14-2010, 06:07 PM
The voice of reason...alas...

wills370
03-14-2010, 07:20 PM
And then you realize with only heavy armored people left then the axemen come in and take the rest... (basically a army not made out of heavies would loose most of it and then the remaining soldiers of the people defending can attack in their own way...) Heavies are terribly slow and loose a lot of people to fast moving axes so DIE HEAVIES (my combination will definitely take down heavies too...) Also you guys should make heavy pikes! (no need to move the pikes with light armors when you can have them bracing spears at on coming charges:D

But what if you follow the heavy's with archers?? They can cover the the ground that the heavy's have already cleared agasint counter. so thoose axes would get shot down pretty fast...HMmm prob have 1/4 army heavy calvery 1/4 army archers and 2/4 heavy infantry. Use the calvery as i described and just have the archers running around shooting what the heavy infantry arent good agasint:P

otomotopia
03-14-2010, 08:19 PM
I can picture people using ranged/seige or AoE skills/units to mow down an area of pikes so they can mount an effective concetrated calvary charge to get rid of the Archers.

Archers will be the biggest problem for balance, IMO. The more space between armies, the worse the damage they can do. It may be that the first decisive strategic commitment of forces will determine the way the battle will go for the rest of the match. If you can't take out enough archers with your first "real" attack, then you're screwed.

Obviously feinting with a good amount of units, distracting the enemy and making them lopsidely focus their units can change that, because if you can get around the battle line, flanking the archers will absolutely tip the game in your favor. But open ground battles will be very interesting with this game. The first stage will totally come down to pike/horse micro management. This should be fuuun xD

Konstantin Fomenko
03-14-2010, 10:23 PM
...with only heavy armored people left then the axemen come in and take the rest
Dwarfs would be the best for this. You would have to travel to the Dwarven Marchers to get some, but it`s worth it - in mass Dwarven Axe Mercenaries are priceless in a siege. Nothing else cuts through Pikeman in Shiltron formation, or Elven Sentry Stone Stance.

Archers will be the biggest problem for balance, That might be true in some cases, but definitely not against Orcs. Goblins, the cheapest unit in a teach tree, can decimate any ranged troops using their Battle Stand formation and Evasion ability (no arrows can hit these small creatures while they are moving).

Human race is pretty balanced in this regard as well. Just train heavy troops with enough heavy plating to make arrows bounce off. Nothing like a slow moving mounted knight slowly advancing on a superior archer force.

And Elfs...well why bother with counters to archers? Just nuke em with a good fire spell.

DarkMaster
03-14-2010, 10:37 PM
no arrows can hit these small creatures while they are moving
Wow. Do you mean that in the literal sense, or in the practical one?

Alex Walz
03-14-2010, 10:58 PM
They're immune to arrows for a few seconds, at the expense of some stamina points. Check the orc beasts FF for more info on the goblins. :)

Konstantin Fomenko
03-14-2010, 11:22 PM
They're immune to arrows for a few seconds
I was just laying siege to a large human stronghold, and few seconds (10?) was enough for the fast-moving goblins to make it through the siege towers and take out most of the Elven Rangers and ballistas on the walls. We really ought to nurf them - it`s more like the undead army form battle for middle earth.

Zeluk
03-15-2010, 12:09 AM
Yeah 10secs don't sound like much but during gameplay it's a lifetime.

GPS51
03-15-2010, 12:26 AM
The more I hear the more I live in expectancy for the first dev vs. dev gameplay video :)

HolyPollo
03-15-2010, 08:24 AM
The screenshots make this entry epic. I'm so excited to see how areas affect people's strategies. It'll be exciting to see who your neighbors will be and how that will change your geographical choice.

Josh Warner
03-15-2010, 08:30 PM
The more I hear the more I live in expectancy for the first dev vs. dev gameplay video :)

Soon TM

But yeah, that will be fun. No idea when that sort of thing will happen, but it'll definitely be fun.

Zeluk
03-15-2010, 08:34 PM
That would be real fun to watch. Anybody care to take bets on who's the best of the Devs!?!

GPS51
03-15-2010, 10:45 PM
Soon TM

.


The story of life. :o

welshie
03-16-2010, 03:43 AM
That would be real fun to watch. Anybody care to take bets on who's the best of the Devs!?!

Ima go for Kon seen as when/where ever i see him post, somewhere in that post hes bragging about destroying some NPC village or flattining huge armys. I'll bet you a ....'looks in pocket' .... Button..... Strings of hair ..... Ohh a fiver, and next weeks dinner :)

Henry Martin
03-16-2010, 08:48 AM
Ima go for Kon seen as when/where ever i see him post, somewhere in that post hes bragging about destroying some NPC village or flattining huge armys. I'll bet you a ....'looks in pocket' .... Button..... Strings of hair ..... Ohh a fiver, and next weeks dinner :)

Interesting, but I would have to go with Joseph Visscher:D. You have to go with the level designer. They are one of biggest influence on gameplay, so they know a lot about it and also know how to use the terrian.

Someone should make a poll about this:eek:.

GPS51
03-16-2010, 09:49 AM
Hey question for said devs ^^ If my army is marching to somewhere far away on the map and I go to bed will my army have been ambushed by the inhabintants of the regions that it passes through? I don't want to come back to find I've got a quarter of my army left.

Konstantin Fomenko
03-16-2010, 11:05 AM
If my army is marching to somewhere far away on the map and I go to bed will my army have been ambushed by the inhabintants of the regions that it passes through?
Nope. I guess this is a safe way to send an army across the realm. But same stands true if your busy on a quest or fighting another player. However, as soon as you log-in someone might attack your army, so it`s always nice to have some extra gold in the army to pay off any would-be attackers.

GPS51
03-16-2010, 11:26 AM
So if I'm logged in my traveling army can be attacked? Would that create a non-seige battle PvP setup? Glad to hear we can buy'em off or ransack them if they trifle with us.

Negthareas
03-16-2010, 01:25 PM
So I could set up my army on common trade routes and get paid by players too small to fight my army, but rich in supplies because they are trading?

Of course, this would only work with caravans whose owners are online, but still, it sounds effective.

Zeluk
03-16-2010, 01:28 PM
so it`s always nice to have some extra gold in the army to pay off any would-be attackers.

Just gonna take this part of your post and ask another question. So in most strategy games I've played resources are an omnipresent thing, the bulk of which rarely if ever take physical forms within the gaming world after the intial gathering. Now I know the basics of how this games economy works, so for certain resources these traditions don't apply. For example livestock and such. But from what you said I'm going to have to actually split my treasury up across my various assets? Keeping a stash with all my armies traveling abroad, so they don't get pwned deep behind enemy territory? While still keeping enough money in my homeland to stave off an assault? Interesting concept. Could bring things like supply trains and stuff into play.

Of course I just might be reading to far into this and nit-picking someone's post.

GPS51
03-16-2010, 01:46 PM
So I could set up my army on common trade routes and get paid by players too small to fight my army, but rich in supplies because they are trading?

Of course, this would only work with caravans whose owners are online, but still, it sounds effective.

Hahaha the ol' bandito trick eh? Then we can hire thief catchers to take said banditos out. This could then spiral outward to involve the neighboring cities then to neighboring clans and then a civil war all over a crossroads. :D

Konstantin Fomenko
03-16-2010, 02:01 PM
So if I'm logged in my traveling army can be attacked
Nope they can`t. Player can only attack your army if your online, and not doing anything productive (like a Quest, PvP or Player vs Environment)

But from what you said I'm going to have to actually split my treasury up across my various assets?
Keep in mind that armies are the best source of income in the game, they kill, pillage and loot, as well as partake in quests, we also might add an option to camp out and gather if there are workers in the army.

Could bring things like supply trains and stuff into play.
Baggage/Supply train is the best way to call this. Your army needs resources to set-up camps (gold and wood), heal (consumes food), hire ships, buy additional units in towns or mercenary camps, and as was mentioned earlier some extra gold to pay off other players if you don`t want to fight.
Another complication to this - soldiers can mostly carry their own weight, so your baggage train is just that - several special units (horse carts, of Ogres for example) that required to keep large amounts of resources with your army.
While army is on a quest, PvP or PvE - these horse-carts are there on the map - so for the enemy it totally makes sense to sneak up on you and burn the baggage train. If you loose these horse-carts, your army won`t be able to carry all it`s resources and would have to leave most of them behind.

In the future Alex W. will do a showcase on MMO Armies - so I`ll let him feel you guys in on all the details in due time. But yeah - DoF armies are more of a multi-purpose-mobile-base that not only fights but also gathers resources, "produces - buys" units, builds camps, hires mercenaries, heals, even research and of-course - fights.

Negthareas
03-16-2010, 08:50 PM
Awesome! Interactive bribery, thieving, and payed bullying!

Swift sword
03-16-2010, 10:06 PM
Ah-so will it sort of be- X units eats Y food per day? And if you're missing Y food, you're in trouble, with loyalty issues, starvation, and worse, I'd guess? Sounds very interactive, although miss one little thing and suddenly you have an army off in enemy territory in a very bad position, which I see as a good thing and a bad thing. If there's a little checking system, telling you what resources you have and how long that'll last you, how far away it is yor troops are going, etc. then it's excellent. If not...it might be a bit much to keep track of.

Konstantin Fomenko
03-16-2010, 10:23 PM
We considered making armies consume food, but no matter how you implement it - it`s mostly an annoying feature. Instead your army can choose to consume food to heal the wounded troops.

DarkMaster
03-16-2010, 11:30 PM
IMO food supply should be the thing that defines population limit, but I'm fine with amount of houses I guess. Yes, having the army directly consume food is annoying. Take Theocracy (relatively unknown game). You almost couldn't have large forces protecting small provinces simply because the food supply was not large enough. You could set up trade routes, but that was a very confusing business in that game.

wills370
03-17-2010, 05:23 AM
We considered making armies consume food, but no matter how you implement it - it`s mostly an annoying feature. Instead your army can choose to consume food to heal the wounded troops.

That sounds a better measure of balance. The whole sustain an army idea is anoying genrally. especially when you are a PVP player who engages in attacks often. They could easily nerf you by destroying your food. (realistic? Yes but anoying OH YEAH!!!). :) Nice idea for the healing though.

welshie
03-17-2010, 05:26 AM
Wow putting that in the game would be an awsome feature, i mean it would limit people to places for such a long time and make logistics a game feature some of which i hardly ever come accros, all i can do is bow down and start drooling over my key board on how much i want the game!

Andy Joslin
03-17-2010, 05:28 AM
IMO food supply should be the thing that defines population limit, but I'm fine with amount of houses I guess..
That wouldn't quite make sense, though. If you had for example 1200 food and 30/50 population limit, you would not be able to spend your food! The more you spent, the lower population you would get. You would go from 30/50 to 35/45, or 40/40, etc.

otomotopia
03-17-2010, 07:58 AM
aye. Using food as a primarely unit building/healing resource makes sense in terms of gameplay, but not in terms of 'real life' (in quotes because this is a fantasy game, after all) application.

But then again, using stone and wood to create a horse doesn't make much sense, either. :rolleyes:

Food is an interesting resource. It should be consumed with every organic thing you make.

So here's an idea! How about having constant food production and constant food consumption, and bring back the idea of armies consuming food.

The reasons are realtively simple. Army size is only limited to how much food they can carry, and how much you can produce, elagently solving the problem of unit overpopulation while still satisfying the softcap crowd. "You're army is as limitless as you can make it!" could be a potential tag... anyway.

On the point of armies consuming food, if you tweak the values of consumption depending if a hero is in it or not (Read-Armies with heroes eat less, armies without eat more), you also solve a couple of potential problems- people making sentry-army webs of two-battalion armies, people sending out multiple large armies mid-'game,' etc.

wills370
03-17-2010, 01:01 PM
Hmm it would have some issues however, what would happen to army's without that food?

Reduces moral (say 5%). This could increase over long periods however to a point where you have disserters?

army die? if so would the low cost units die first to reflect importance in the army?

Thoose who live in areas where you can get food easily would have a large bonus and thoose selling it would probably have it become the most expensive recource as everyone would need it more then anything. Gold/wood would not be needed for maintanance

Elves also would have huge issues as hey gain food from gatheres and it is a slow process which would slow there ecomony further as they could not move to other areas of production after a large army is in play.

May have other balancing issues also.

Negthareas
03-17-2010, 03:31 PM
Elves will not have as large armies.

Still - I think that if an army is going to consume food, one of the best ways to do it is just have it subtracted directly from your "food stock", as if the logistics were being automatically done for you.

Otherwise, ditch the idea.

Still - It would limit the size of armies. If a player can only have four cities or so, his armies would be limited to the amount of food he can produce/obtain. that way there are no gargantuan armies of a hundred thousand men wandering around the world.

DarkMaster
03-17-2010, 03:41 PM
Still - I think that if an army is going to consume food, one of the best ways to do it is just have it subtracted directly from your "food stock", as if the logistics were being automatically done for you.


This is sort of what I was getting at. In other words, the farms replace houses as the pop-cap "upgrade". Maybe if you're under your cap, the extra food could be added to your regular stockpile?

EDIT: Another purpose for the extra food might be population "growth". A bit like in Civ, for example.

Swift sword
03-17-2010, 04:17 PM
We considered making armies consume food, but no matter how you implement it - it`s mostly an annoying feature. Instead your army can choose to consume food to heal the wounded troops.
Ah. I miss interpreted your post, I suppose, although you're right. I was a bit uncertain when I read it, it would simply be an annoyance and make some serious nerfs to balance (cavalry in particular) neccessary, which we don't want.
In any case, it makes more sense for food to heal units but not in the "instantaneous" sort of way- more of a gradual, overtime heal of troops. Sort of the way WoW's implemented it-pots are instant, food is gradual. It may be an MMORPG (WoW that is), but it'd work well for DoF as well.

sirdustin
03-17-2010, 05:16 PM
This game looks awesome cant wait.

Supreme
03-18-2010, 03:14 AM
Heh, amount of votes going up per poll ever so slightly ^^

Kire
03-18-2010, 04:00 AM
Southmont has dangerously high votes =P, i guess there are many ppl like me who like to have fortified castles. I hope elves will also have one option of fortified castle =P.

blackfang
03-18-2010, 08:51 AM
Southmont has dangerously high votes =P, i guess there are many ppl like me who like to have fortified castles. I hope elves will also have one option of fortified castle =P.

They would probably have something like fortified tree. Anyways southmont don't deserve that many votes. SOMEONE VOTE THE WORLD!:eek:

welshie
03-18-2010, 11:41 AM
Lol's everyones saying to many people on southmont but look at the number of humans -> other races only 13 said they wouldnt stoop that low to be human out of what 50? Sooooooo i think forget about balancing wold and rolling plains balance elves and orcs !

blackfang
03-18-2010, 12:49 PM
Lol's everyones saying to many people on southmont but look at the number of humans -> other races only 13 said they wouldnt stoop that low to be human out of what 50? Sooooooo i think forget about balancing wold and rolling plains balance elves and orcs !

you thought about the possibility that most people will test all the races? And that those who will test humans will go to southmont it doesn't say that the humans are their main race. I mean i will never stoop so low that i will play elves but i will play orcs and elves:D

welshie
03-18-2010, 01:09 PM
you thought about the possibility that most people will test all the races? And that those who will test humans will go to southmont it doesn't say that the humans are their main race. I mean i will never stoop so low that i will play elves but i will play orcs and elves:D

That did cross my mind as my finger clicked submit.. :P

LiTos456
03-18-2010, 01:21 PM
Awesome! And it's weird but as much as I hate snow I'm going to make my settlement be in the Wold. Be what you despise!

Alex Walz
03-18-2010, 03:07 PM
All the regions except Brakental will get snow. ;)

crispyg29
03-18-2010, 07:25 PM
so the game will change seasons? like there will be a summer fall winter and spring kinda thing? or is it random

otomotopia
03-18-2010, 08:02 PM
Seasons have been confirmed.

Alex Walz
03-18-2010, 08:31 PM
There's not a Spring or a Fall, just Summer and Winter. The season can be set in custom skirmishes and in the MMORTS, it's on a cycle where 24 minutes = 24 game hours. There's a couple random effects like snow, rain, and lightning.

otomotopia
03-18-2010, 09:01 PM
however, I've never heard THAT. Thats pretty sick, nice job there.

crispyg29
03-19-2010, 03:00 AM
thats awesome i was curious how the season thing was gonna work and thanks for anwsering:D

HolyPollo
03-19-2010, 06:21 AM
We considered making armies consume food, but no matter how you implement it - it`s mostly an annoying feature. Instead your army can choose to consume food to heal the wounded troops.

Thank you! I hate when developers decide, "We're going to add this feature, because it adds realism to the game" when the feature is mostly pointless and involves incredibly annoying upkeep. It's fantasy, I'm pretty sure we're suspending reality for a second here. Better to enjoy the game out of the gate than have an additional "realistic" feature.

Justin
03-19-2010, 06:59 AM
So a game your would take about a week if there were 360 days in a year but if we are skipping 2 seasons how does it work, and if its only like 4 days per season I know i will hoard resources to sell to npcs if they pay better in one season vs the other, or is it not being broken down 50 50 in a real amount of days just sped up year?

Andy Joslin
03-19-2010, 07:01 AM
So a game year approximately per week, so seasons are about 2 days each, i guess people will hord their resources for the right season to sell to npcs

Yes, it is about 2 days per season.

Kire
03-19-2010, 08:00 AM
Meh i was hoping to see trees with less and less leaves or coming back on it and also going grass from green to brownish and vice versa =/.
But summer should be at least 6 (5?) days and winter 2 since snowless are usually 3 seasons and snow just winter.

Bluecewe
03-19-2010, 10:42 AM
Interesting stuff. Nice amount of media in that post. :)

Puppeteer
03-19-2010, 12:18 PM
Heh, Summer and Winter are more than you get in some games - it's either you play the map with snow, or not at all. If there's such a high demand for Spring and Autumn than I'm sure it could come later in a patch.

blackfang
03-19-2010, 01:04 PM
or they could implant it now:)

welshie
03-19-2010, 01:16 PM
or they could implant it now:)

Look i want the game asap, dont make the devs do more aswome work :) They have a schedual you know..

Negthareas
03-19-2010, 02:16 PM
As I said before, I think the reason so many players pick Southmount is this: they know that they will be unfamilior with the game, so their first reaction is "safety" - mountain castles with streams in front sount good for turtling, so they pick Southmount.

I have no clue who I am going to start as in the MMORTS first. I intend to do all three - I imagine that, even though this is mmoRTS, there will get to a point at your homecities and trade caravans where waiting will not hurt you too much. Also, think - If you are online, your caravans and you can get attacked.

Therefore, if you can maximize the effects created by a minimum of time, you could very easily play the three different civilizations at once.


Also, about chatting - is that world chat? I know that on Evony, world chat goes by so fast you can't even read it or reply to anything. I hope the chat will have lots of settings.

crispyg29
03-19-2010, 02:22 PM
ya i agree because i know both of my friends who are wanting this game plan on just defending and never attacking because lets face it majority of ppl like defending more than attacking

welshie
03-19-2010, 02:26 PM
My natural instincts were 'Ohhhh shiney castle>everything else' so southmont would have been perfect then i read into it a bit more and decided i'd rather start off where i can experience all aspects of play before dedicating my self to eaither defender/attacker/farmer. Then i shall use my other spots to do what i think i prefer and test my combanations, thus not cutting off vital early experience in any aspect so i can change tatics and stragities to suite.

otomotopia
03-19-2010, 02:36 PM
If I went human, I'd gravitate towards Rollingplain. I'd take less expensive footmen, macemen, and Calv any day, and with extra fast calvary, momentum shouldn't be as much as a problem. I'll be able to take a huge economic monopoly on trading goods: gold to Southmount for the extra food I'd need, not to mention raking in tons of timber from the mine-scarce wold.

I'm extremely surprised people aren't going for the the Rollingplain. I think the food is scaring them away, but trading will take care of that.

Alex Walz
03-19-2010, 07:56 PM
Meh i was hoping to see trees with less and less leaves or coming back on it and also going grass from green to brownish and vice versa =/.
But summer should be at least 6 (5?) days and winter 2 since snowless are usually 3 seasons and snow just winter.
We may change it - personally I like the summer setting much more.
But the four seasons aren't universal. Many climates only experience one or two distinct seasons. Utah, for example, is unpredictable and lacks a distinct Spring or Fall - it went from six inches of snow a couple days ago to 60 degrees the next day, and we often experience snow in late April and September. ;) Other cultures, like the Celts, celebrate five distinct seasons. And considering Mythador isn't in our universe, they could have completely different weather patterns. ;)

Also, about chatting - is that world chat? I know that on Evony, world chat goes by so fast you can't even read it or reply to anything. I hope the chat will have lots of settings.
In-game, you can either chat with a select individual or with your closest neighbors, but you will have to be in the lobby to world chat, I do believe.

Zeluk
03-19-2010, 10:50 PM
Chatting with neighbors will probably be what I do the most.

Negthareas
03-20-2010, 09:13 AM
In-game, you can either chat with a select individual or with your closest neighbors, but you will have to be in the lobby to world chat, I do believe.

Thanks for letting me know! If there is any chance of - alliances/guilds, etc - will they be added on as extra chat features? Also, I am assuming you can chat privately with people.

Alex Walz
03-20-2010, 10:07 AM
Yeah, you can chat privately and, most likely, with your guild mates.

Zeluk
03-20-2010, 10:11 AM
Guild chat was almost a given I assumed. Almost every MMO out there had some form of Guild chat.

Kire
03-20-2010, 10:52 AM
But the four seasons aren't universal. Many climates only experience one or two distinct seasons. Utah, for example, is unpredictable and lacks a distinct Spring or Fall - it went from six inches of snow a couple days ago to 60 degrees the next day, and we often experience snow in late April and September. ;) Other cultures, like the Celts, celebrate five distinct seasons. And considering Mythador isn't in our universe, they could have completely different weather patterns. ;)


Nice idea ... it could be set so that sometimes unpredictable snow comes sooner or last longer or thing like that =P ..... I know it isnt universal but because its different its also more interesting =).
Or there can be at least 3 seasons summer=spring (which isnt much different except usually on amount of rain and temperatures), winter and one season thats between summer and winter (which, as you said, sometimes isnt even here so can come summers sooner or snow sooner. So you will need to farm quicker to get food before winter come o.- ..... cuz you never know when the first snow will be =).

Edit: (when cleared mind, conclusion of above) There should be something between summer and winter so its not just: full of snow -> summer (should be time to melt). And another thing is .. making it 2 days vs 2 days may become dull after some time, so would be interesting to have sometimes 3 days summer and 1 day winter or any other combination.

Justin
03-20-2010, 12:15 PM
The 2 seasons is probably easier in many respects than having 4 making it simpler and involving less strategy based on days since the season has an effect on certain aspects of game play, it makes sense this way, also if days take 24 minutes does that mean there is daytime and nighttime or not?

Negthareas
03-20-2010, 03:33 PM
I know this might be hard to implement, but it would be kind of cool to have a day where the snow melted, and water levels were high. this would make for very interesting gameplay, with limited movement and many chokepoints.

blackfang
03-20-2010, 03:39 PM
I know this might be hard to implement, but it would be kind of cool to have a day where the snow melted, and water levels were high. this would make for very interesting gameplay, with limited movement and many chokepoints.

Also don't forget the irritated landlords that just lost their villages after a flood:rolleyes: Ahh the good points about elevated water levels;)

Kaznafein
03-30-2010, 10:36 AM
The wold, I'm all about the ranged units and dealing as much damage as i can while taking a minimal amount. Open beta plz:D. I know I know when the time comes.

otomotopia
04-09-2010, 06:51 AM
So how will these bonuses factor into Single-player/Non-MMO Multiplayer modes? Will we select a race and then a 'homeland?'

Darathor
04-09-2010, 03:17 PM
I don't think so, I think that those bonuses are exclusive to MMORTS mode, which helps make it even more unique. Skirmish mode will likely just be pick your race/color in terms of pre-game customization.

Alex Walz
04-09-2010, 08:13 PM
It's not finalized whether or not it will be in Build and Defend, but it will probably be reserved for MMORTS to make battles simpler and faster.

DarkMaster
04-10-2010, 12:56 AM
I for one think that it should be in some, if not all, skirmish modes.

Khan kreiger
06-18-2010, 07:15 AM
Nice i like the environments and the graphics....just outstanding:D

Hanador
07-06-2010, 01:35 PM
Dig the looks of the Rollingplains and the Wold but im more of a forest/archer dude ill prolly be Wold.
Also....are there any human lands that ARE suitable for raising domestic animals (besides sheep in southmont)?

Khan kreiger
07-07-2010, 04:59 AM
Dig the looks of the Rollingplains and the Wold but im more of a forest/archer dude ill prolly be Wold.
Also....are there any human lands that ARE suitable for raising domestic animals (besides sheep in southmont)?

these are the only three regions so no there isn't a way to raise any domestic animals other then sheep,cows & pigs

Khan kreiger
07-07-2010, 05:04 AM
more people chose to be men then any other race wow

Revenger571
02-27-2011, 08:35 PM
Man, tough choice but im probably gonna pick southmont for defense :D